Why did so many BAME (Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic) voted Tory?

Another amazing podcast from Veedu Vidz–heartthrob of England. {Sisters, he is already owned by Mimzy and unavailable. Sorry.}

Start watching from 25 minutes in. Some take-aways:

  • Chinese earn the most per hour of any group in Britain.
  • Indians earn the second most of any group in Britain. {Chinese continue to economically outperform Indians globally and in Britain.}
    • Do Chinese and Indians really earn more per hour than English Jews? I am skeptical. What is beyond all doubt is that British caucasians are massively academically and socio-economically under performing Jews, Chinese and Indians.
  • The sample sizes for Chinese and Indian Britons is too small to know how they voted for certain. But it is possible that Chinese, Indian, Sikh Buddhist Hindu and moderate muslim Indians voted against Jeremy Corbyn in part because of Corbyn’s close alliance with conservative Sunni and Islamist groups.
  • Before 2019, Pakistani and Bangladeshi Britons  use to heavily vote for Jeremy Corbyn and Labour.
    • Brown Pundit favorite Sajid Javid has received a lot of abuse for being a muslim Tory.
  • Tory Priti Patel (who I just heard about for the first time) has also received a lot of abuse.
    • (Is part of the English anger at Priti Patel jealousy over the socio-economic success of Indians? Given how many Indian Britons vote Tory, how can it be because of that?)
    • Priti Patel wants a point based (merit based) immigration system. (Why is this controversial among caucasian English people?)
  • There is a great deal of diversity among the British muslim population
  • Veedu Vidz says that Boris Johnson is anti everyone who is not Boris Johnson.
  • 38 minutes in discusses deep anti Jewish bigotry on the part of English caucasians, the Labour party and Jeremy Corbyn.
    • comes from the far left
    • comes from the far right
    • need to focus a lot more on muslim anti Jewish bigotry
  • 43 minutes in, many working class caucasian and BAME voters probably are voting Tory in part because they are so scared of being accused of racism by their representatives for asking questions.
  • 46 minutes in, Labour has lost its moral legitimacy on racism, bigotry and sectarianism. Labour and the BMP are the only two parties in English history to be investigated by the Equality and Human Rights commission for misconduct.
  • 58 minutes in, many poor and working class caucasian britons have suffered from globalization and have no privilege at all. Labour should stop accusing them of having non-existent privilege.
  • 60 minutes, many Labour try to blame the world’s social ills on Britain. (I am stunned that this still happens. England has been falling apart for generations and is in many ways more backwards than many of her former colonies. Talk about delusions of grandeur.)
  • 63 minutes in Veedu asks if Hindus have an advantage over muslims in Britain.

My questions:

  • I get why many Britons felt they could not vote for Corbyn and Labour. Why didn’t more vote Liberal Democrat?
  • Can anyone send me an exit poll with granular detail on 2019 UK voting patterns?

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Update 1:

Maajid Nawaz Gob-smacks Corbyn and says Corbyn beat Corbyn.

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Update 2:

Katie Hopkins is a Member of the Tory party and is trying hard to create an alliance between the UK and India (and presumably the Dharmic world more generally). The alliance would focus on resisting:

  • Globalism (which she mostly defines as post modernist wokeness, perhaps combined with pro business free markets to a lesser degree)
  • Islamism
  • Feminism (by which I think she means third wave woke post modernist intersectional femnism)

To simplify, I think she mostly means post modernism and Islamism. She appears to think the Europe will divide into Islamist hamlets and non Islamist hamlets. And that Europe and the world as a whole needs India’s and America’s help to survive.

Could the UK government pursue an alliance with India focused on post modernism and Islamism? Could this end any remaining Indian sensitivity about being colonized by the UK? Is this being facilitated by Indian Britons and perhaps muslim Indian Britons leaving the Labour party?

Sham Sharma has speculated that Indian Americans could wholesale flip to the Republican Party similar to the flip of Indian Britons between 2017 and 2019? Could this really happen?

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Update 3:

It is possible that British Asian, African, ethnic minority, poor and lower middle class European ancestry voters were scared about anti Jewish bigotry:

As a side note, the UK has very different issues than the USA. For example UK students perform far better in math than Americans. 13% scored 5 or higher in the 2018 OECD PISA test, compared to 8% of Americans.  Immigrants appear to slightly academically underperform non-immigrant Brits across reading, science and math, although mathematical performance  was not provided. The definition of “disadvantaged students” in the report was unclear.  Between 2009 and 2018 the number of immigrant students has risen from 11% to 20%. One third of immigrant students are “disadvantaged students.” Math results for England have been rising over time and girls sharply outscored boys in mathematics, science and reading.

+++++++++++++++++++

Update 4:

According to Nimco Ali (patriotic Briton who happens to have Somali muslim ancestry) most African Britons vote Tory. She is a leading campaigner against female genetic mutilation and says that Tory leaders, Tory moderate muslims and Tory Indians (Priti Patel ) are backing her. Nimco also fights for muslim woman to have the right not to wear the hijab, and again says that she gets support from many Tory leaders, Tory moderate muslims and Tory Indians (Priti Patel ). She is very aspirational. She says that in Britain the aspirational BAME are African Britons and Indian Britons. Both back the Tories. The less aspirational Britons are Pakistanis and they tend to support Labour and Jeremy Corbyn. I am guessing that Bangladeshis are in the middle.

I wonder why more African Britons don’t vote Liberal Democrat. My main man Maajid Nawaz is Liberal Democrat. I get why African Britons don’t like Jeremy Corbyn.

Nimco Ali says that Briton has recently prosecuted several muslim Britons for female genetic mutilation of children. Until recently no Briton was prosecuted for female genetic mutilation. About a tenth of mothers giving birth to children in many British hospitals have had FGM. Kudos to Boris Johnson, Brown Pundit favorite Sajid Javid, Priti Patel and other Britons for trying to end FGM!

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49 Replies to “Why did so many BAME (Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic) voted Tory?”

  1. Indians dat dere rich in the USA with that patel motel sense, south Indian tech startups, Punjabi plantations, and Brahmin academics

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    1. “thewarlock” . . . this use to be. Now Deshi (SAARC) Americans are massively over represented at the top of all professions and modalities with the exception of sports, physical fitness, hunks, awesomeness. 🙁

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      1. I am helping change that 😉

        Also 2nd gen in general doing better. We lifting heavy and looking more aesthetic. And we also still got det doctor status. Gains all around

        May the sky father smile upon you. May the river mother bless you. Jai Shree Ameen. May you evade the CAB

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        1. thewarlock wrote “I am helping change that 😉”

          Good. The lack of sports, exercise, stretching, breathing, meditation are among the biggest problems Deshis face.

          “May the sky father smile upon you. May the river mother bless you. Jai Shree Ameen. May you evade the CAB”

          CAB only applies to refugees seeking asylum in India who do not already have PIO or immigration status and who can’t use other visas. India hands out 10 year tourist visas liberally as she should.

          “Sky Father” =
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyeus
          This is often chanted in Vedic Samhita recitations, yajnas and pujas. Dyeus or Zeus is one of the eight Vasus (Pritvi/earth/solid, Varuna/Jala/liquid, Agni/fire, Vayu/Praana/wind/energy, Akaasha/ether, Sun, Chandra/moon, Stars in the sky . . . especially symbolized by Polaris)
          Dyeus or Zeus is synonymous with Akaasha or ether which permeates the universe. Dyeus is one of the most commonly cited and important names of the oldest Arya texts, including the oldest Vedic Samhitas. Dyeus or Zeus incarnated as Bhishma in the Mahabharata. Sky Father and unchangeable immovable witness indeed.

          Jai Shree Ameen!

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  2. What is beyond all doubt is that British caucasians are massively academically and socio-economically under performing Jews, Chinese and Indians.”

    Since the seventies, mainstream Anglosphere culture has devalued education and achievement. Jewish, Chinese and Indian subcultures however, still encourage academics.

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  3. Why did so many BAME (Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic) voted Tory?

    all that matters the exits. are they out?

    it seems class+antisemitism. indians are more tory than pak/bang (richer), and jews have gotten fed up with labour tolerance for antisemitic elements in the guise of antizionism (you can argue whether jews are on solid ground, just how they feel).

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    1. Conservative Jews don’t care about antisemitism, they just hate the left because the latter criticizes the Israeli occupation. There are dramatically more antisemitic figures and incidents from Western conservative parties, but since these parties support Israel, conservative Jews keep their mouths shut.

      Also, regarding anti-Zionism, you are behind the ball. The stance from conservative Jews in both Europe and the US that they have been officially pushing for a decade now, is that anti-zionism by definition is antisemitism.

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  4. There are dramatically more antisemitic figures and incidents from Western conservative parties, but since these parties support Israel, conservative Jews keep their mouths shut.

    what fuck are you talking about? you need to stop mouth-farting sometimes. i know it makes you feel good and releases pressure but you are getting gibberishy. though i get you enjoy being a troll. unless you are totally a moron or in total bad-faith you have to know that a low level of antisemitism is normative with the muslim communities of the west, analogous to antimuslimism among western hindus (curious if you will straight lie about this).

    to distinguish kabir and you, i think in general he sounds stupid. i think he’s on the whole less intelligent than you. i think you just enjoy the troll game. you’re like the web 2.0 version of ikram.

    the jewish population in the UK is highly structured. you probably don’t know that cuz you don’t know much from what i have seen, but generalizing is not super informative beyond this election. the frum will stay tory. the rest probably depends on how much islam is the labour party religion at prayer in the near future (though post-jewish ppl of jewish origin [in part] will have no issues with left not sure they’ll show up as ‘jews’ on surveys).

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    1. Indthings:

      “Conservative Jews don’t care about antisemitism”
      :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
      “There are dramatically more antisemitic figures and incidents from Western conservative parties”
      :LOL: :LOL: :LOL:
      “but since these parties support Israel, conservative Jews keep their mouths shut.
      :LOL: :LOL: :LOL: Mouth shut? Clearly has not met Jews.

      “The stance from conservative Jews in both Europe and the US that they have been officially pushing for a decade now, is that anti-zionism by definition is antisemitism.”

      What is Zionism?

      Jews and Palestinians are one family with a shared heart and soul. What benefits Jews benefits Palestinians more than it benefits Jews. What benefits Palestinians benefits Jews more than it benefits Palestinians. Palestinians and Israelis have common long term interests and common values.

      Mysterious, deep and sweet beyond reckoning is the divine romance and poignant love between Israeli and Palestinian. Come not between them.

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      1. I hope someone steals your land and settles themselves upon it. Then we’ll see if you talk about having “one heart and soul” with your Occupier.

        Not surprising that the Hindutvadi Modi supporter is so pro Zionist. After all both groups hate Muslims (or in your case just “conservative Sunnis”)

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          1. Legal immigration is different from settler colonialism and Occupation as you well know. My family did not steal land from native-born Americans or render them stateless.

            I find this notion that Palestinians and Zionists have “one heart and soul” to be ridiculous and offensive. A cursory look at a map of Palestine in 1947, 1967 and today shows that the Palestinians have lost almost all their territory while the Zionists have continued to steal it. All in the service of a settler-colonial ideology that claims that a certain people are entitled to the land because of their religion. “A land without a people for a people without a land” was literally the slogan which is so obviously colonialist that no decent person should be able to argue otherwise.

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  5. The big win for BoJo is a essentially a English blow back against immigration and security. i.e. chavs vs liberals and immigrant Brits. The latest knifing may be factor for voting pattern.

    Much like what happened in Sri Lanka, US and India.

    Many of English, 80% of England, voted across party lines to take back their country, i.e leave the EU and against immigration*.
    Very obvious, the heavily immigrant areas like London went to Labor (red).

    This is the Nationalist trend in the US (Trump wins flyover country), India (Modi wins the cow belt), Sri Lanka (Gotabaya wins the Sinhala areas).
    The majority is crossing traditional party lines to vote for majority ethos.

    *Immigration, Black brown or White (Eastern Europe.

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    1. “This is the Nationalist trend in the US (Trump wins flyover country), India (Modi wins the cow belt), Sri Lanka (Gotabaya wins the Sinhala areas).”

      Interesting that you compared Gotabaya and Modi there. Just like how Gotabaya won Sinalese areas, do you mean to say Modi won “Hindu” areas.

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      1. Saurav wrote:
        “do you mean to say Modi won “Hindu” areas.”

        Perhaps he means Harijans. My impression is that Modi appears to have done well with Buddhists, Jains and Sikhs. Is this true?

        Sikhs might also be considered one of the largest groups in India. But I don’t consider Sikhs to be a single group, caste or Sampradaya (religion.) Sikhs have many large religions embedded inside it or adjacent to it. Many Indian religions are both Sikh as well as associated with non Sikh Dharmic Sampradayas and Sufi muslim Sampradayas.

        Indian Muslims are definitely not one caste, group or Sampradaya. But rather consist of many different tribes (castes or Jatis), ethnicities (by language and culture) and Sampradayas. Including the large ex muslim Sampradaya and atheist muslim Sampradaya.

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      2. Saurav
        Interesting that you compared Gotabaya and Modi there. Just like how Gotabaya won Sinalese areas, do you mean to say Modi won “Hindu” areas.

        I said Modi won the “cow belt”, i.e. Hindi speaking Hindus. I gather the the Tamil Hindus did not vote for Modi.

        Modi made some words about 13A amendment, forced down Sri Lankas throat by Rajiv Gandhi in 1987. It is about devolution, mostly for Tamil areas. Gotabaya in an interview, pretty much said not on my watch. I dont think Modi gives a damn, Tamils did not vote for him.

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        1. How is Modi (with his generic antipathy towards tamils) looked upon among the Sinhalese?

          Better than Congress and Nehru dynasty (along with their tamil ally DMK) or the same old “Indians are invading our island” view persist?

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          1. How is Modi (with his generic antipathy towards Tamils) looked upon among the Sinhalese?
            I dont think most (rural) Sinhalese realize that Modi is not all that all with the Tamils. Then again I am in an area of the least educated, i.e. not even a newspaper for sale. I think the young get news on FB etc.

            “Indians are invading our island” view persist?
            Thats not going to go away.
            Keywords like 13A, i.e. devolution thats a Trojan Horse for Indians (i.e. Tamils to invade the country). Luckily Gotabaya categorically said not on my watch.

            The big hero these days is Aung San Suu Kyi (in Sinhalese press) for defending Myanmar.

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    2. Razib, both Veedu the wise (stud of Pakistani physical attractiveness) and Rakib Ehsan detest the concept of BAME (Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic) and refuse to speak in terms of it.

      They said that Indians appeared to vote against Labour in large numbers, including moderate muslim Indians. They said that moderate British muslims in general might have voted against Labour in droves. I think this is right. But need more data to verify. What I would be curious to learn is if former Indian Labour voters voted Tory or Liberal Democrats.

      They mentioned that Indian muslims were significantly less likely to vote Labour than Pakistanis and Bangladeshis.

      Why is this? Is it because British Indian muslims tend to be far more minority and liberal than British Pakistani and Bangladeshi muslims? How can this granular detail to estimated?

      The below articles suggest that British Hindus overwhelmingly voted against Labour in 2019. Many British black Africans (do most British prefer “black” to “African” similar to America?) also voted against Labour. But Pakistani and Bangladeshi muslims stayed with Labour. Is this true?
      https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/15/britains-new-political-landscape
      https://inews.co.uk/opinion/general-election-2019-ethnic-minority-vote-volatile-1336651

      Does the UK not do large detailed exit polls?

      ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
      sbarrkum wrote:

      “The big win for BoJo is a essentially a English blow back against immigration and security. i.e. chavs vs liberals and immigrant Brits. The latest knifing may be factor for voting pattern.”

      sbarrkum, in England Brexit means far more legal UK immigration from the commonwealth, including Africa, India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Afghanistan, Sri Lanka, Nepal, Myamnar, Malaysia. BoJo (Boris Johnson for home gamers) is more pro Asian and African immigration than Corbyn. Corbyn opposed Brexit and favored more immigration from EU countries and less immigration from Africa and Asia.

      Suspect this might have contributed to Indian Britons strongly voting against Corbyn, and many African Britons abandoning Corbyn. Did a majority of African Britons vote against Corbyn in the last election? How large a majority of Indian Britons voted against Corbyn in the last election. 60%? 70%? 80% Exit polls, where are you?

      Knifing almost certainly further turned African and Asian voters against Corbyn. Many African Britons and Asian Britons suffered from the upsurge in violent crime and were scared.

      “Much like what happened in Sri Lanka, US and India.” Can you elaborate?

      “Many of English, 80% of England, voted across party lines to take back their country, i.e leave the EU and against immigration.”

      By English do you mean “white” or “caucasian”?

      “Very obvious, the heavily immigrant areas like London went to Labor (red).”

      If you look at what exit polls we have, Labour lost a lot of voters in heavily immigrant areas like London. My question is how many of these former Labour voting Asian and African Britons switched to Liberal Democrat versus Tory. Don’t yet know this.

      “This is the Nationalist trend in the US (Trump wins flyover country), India (Modi wins the cow belt)”
      How do you define cow belt? Are you referring to the surge in Modi voters among Harijans (although many now seem to self identify as their parampara rather than Harijans . . . most dislike the Dalit label)?

      In India PM Modi and his allies won most seats with more than 40% and 30% to 40% muslim voter concentration. Modi and his allies won many such muslim voter heavy districts in UP, Bengal, Rajasthan. Modi, however does not appear to be popular (okay heavy understatement) among Kerala and Kashmir muslims.

      I would be very curious to hear perspectives about why some Indian muslims (maybe a third) ally with the BJP (including in Rajasthan, UP, Bengal, and the Nizzamis in Delhi) while other muslims (such as the Jama Masjid in Delhi) vote for the left (maybe two thirds)?

      “Sri Lanka (Gotabaya wins the Sinhala areas).”

      Can you write an article about this.

      “The majority is crossing traditional party lines to vote for majority ethos.”

      India has no majority. Only minorities. Tens of thousands of minority religions, tribes, castes (here defined to mean Jatis). The largest groups/castes/religions in India are probably the twelvers, Chistie and Deobondi. I am not aware of any other religions or groups which are as numerous as any of these three. Unless you consider all Harijans to be a group in India. If so, then they are the largest. While Harijans are part of the Modi base . . . I don’t think Harijans think collectively. Most Harijans might be far more connected to their sampradayas (thousands of religions, and Jatis (tribes)) than they are to vague abstract ideas of “Harijanism” or “Dalitism”.

      “Immigration, Black brown or White (Eastern Europe.”

      I am confused. Eastern Europeans probably opposed Brexit since it would sharply reduce immigration from Eastern Europe. I am guessing Eastern Europeans might have supported the Liberal Democrats or to a lesser degree Corbyn. Assuming they cared about Eastern European immigration to England, which is an assumption.

      Indians appear to have gone heavily Tory and Liberal Democrat–abandoning Labour wholesale.

      Pakistanis and Bangladeshis appear to have heavily voted Labour. But did the percentage drop sharply from 2017? We need exit polls people.

      Blacks appear to have abandoned Labour in large numbers and voted Liberal Democrat and Tory instead.

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  6. anan, i don’t know why you spend so much words on this. indians are middle class. so natural tory. a lot of indian muslims are ismaili or kenyan/uganda indians. outside of woke-twitter bubble i assume no one believes tories are nazi.

    the anti-zionist & socialist stance of labour will naturally attract muslims who are against israel in the abstract, and definitely poorer.

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    1. “a lot of indian muslims are ismaili or kenyan/uganda indians”

      Fascinating.

      How many Indians, Indian muslims and British moderate muslims voted Liberal Democrat? The Liberal Democrats had a large surge in votes in the 2019 elections.

      “the anti-zionist & socialist stance of labour will naturally attract muslims who are against israel in the abstract, and definitely poorer.”

      Agreed that most British conservative muslims voted Labour. But did they vote for Labour in much smaller percentages (albeit still majorities) than they did in 2017? And if so, did these former Labour conservative muslim voters support the Liberal Democrats or Tories?

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  7. Kabir,

    Know you are a very patriotic American. But if you could vote in the UK, who would you support?

    My guess is that you would vote Liberal Democrat and support Maajid Nawaz and Quilliam. All deeply pro muslim heroes.

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    1. Labour all the way. I am a good leftist and hope that I will always be one.

      In a two-party system a vote for Liberal Democrats is basically handing victory to Tories.

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      1. You prefer to vote Labour. Get it.

        What do you think about the Liberal Democrats though? Maajid Nawaz is a Liberal Democrat.

        Separately, do you support Maajid Nawaz and Quilliam?

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        1. As I said, voting Liberal Democrat only helps the Tories.
          I don’t know enough about Maajid Nawaz to have an opinion either way.

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        2. Amongst the UK Muslims I know, Maajid Nawaz is widely regarded as a clown. He was idiotic enough to join an extremist outfit in his youth. He then transitioned into lecturing Muslims on their need to reform Islam and counter extremists while having minimal knowledge about the religion and not being a practicing Muslim himself. He exacerbates that by posing as an expert to clueless right-wing think-tankers and their followers in government. He doesn’t know anything, this is the career he has stumbled into.

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  8. Corbyn is a straight up anti Semite. No two ways about it.

    He and his cult of the unhinged London hipsters have totally screwed the Parliamentary Labour Party and it is unclear whether Labour can recover from this infestation to actually win elections (as opposed to “winning” arguments on blogs and twitter).

    In any case, who cares. I’d vote Tory anyway whom I find rather centrist and generally sensible on economy.

    PS: As always the impotent heartburn about Israel is fun to watch. Am Yisrael Chai.

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  9. i don’t think corbyn is an antisemite. i just think he thinks that a bit of antisemitism to go along with antizionism might be something u have to tolerate to have solidarity with third world ppl or whatever.

    Labour can recover from this infestation to actually win elections

    good!

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    1. Razib, I think Corbyn genuinely backs conservative muslims against moderate ones, and has some deep anger against Jews. Seen his comments over many, many years.

      He has white savior complex and genuinely thinks that caucasians are smarter, more aware of righteousness, and more powerful than darkies. He believes in white privilege and white supremacy.

      1000% Nonsense.
      ++++++++++

      I also don’t think it is good for Indian Britons, African Britons and moderate muslims to completely abandon Labour. Because then Labour might start to hate African, Indian and moderate muslim Britons and actively trying to harm them as “white supremacist” “racist” “bigoted” “sectarian” “Islamophobic” “hegemonic”, “imperialist”, “oppressive”, “exploitative” enemies of Briton.

      It also reduces Indian Britons, African Britons and moderate muslim Britons leverage over the Lib Dems and Tories–since they can’t credibly threaten to donate to and vote for Labour.

      It is dangerous to fall into the trap that black African Americans fell into becoming hostage to the Democrats. Best to be a swing voter.

      ++++++
      Slapstik:
      “As always the impotent heartburn about Israel is fun to watch. Am Yisrael Chai.”

      +1000

      Go Israel. Go Palestine. Palestine Israel Friends Forever PIFF.

      ++++++++++++++++++++++++

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      1. “Palestine Israel Friends Forever”

        You have some strange ideas about friendship. Would you be friends with someone who kicks you out of your house and moves in themselves? That is what you are asking of Palestinians.

        People need to choose between supporting the oppressor or the oppressed. Leftists always support the oppressed while rightists seem to favor the oppressor hence the right-wing support for Zionism.

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        1. “Would you be friends with someone who kicks you out of your house and moves in themselves?”
          Probably. Shouldn’t we love our enemy with all our heart, all our soul, all our mind and all our might.

          “That is what you are asking of Palestinians.”
          How about the Hong Kong model of resistance to harsh occupation? Hong Kong decided to become richer, academically better, more successful and more powerful than their occupier oppressor. Hong Kong started to buy up and take over England in the 1990s.

          “People need to choose between supporting the oppressor or the oppressed.”
          I love and support both oppressed and oppressor. They share a common soul and heart. Deep, beautiful and sweet are the flows of love between them. The relationship between their souls (Ananda Maya Kosha).

          “Leftists always support the oppressed”
          Who is oppressed? Who is oppressor?
          What is “left”?

          “while rightists seem to favor the oppressor”
          Oppressed benefit more from the success of oppressor than from their own success. Oppressor benefits more from the success of the oppressed than from their own success. Oppressor and oppressed share common values and long term interests.

          “hence the right-wing support for Zionism.”
          I don’t know what “right-wing” means? I don’t know what “Zionist” means.

          I do know that I love Palestinians and Israelis a lot!

          Palestine Israel Friends Forever 🙂

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          1. Don’t be disingenuous and pretend you don’t know what left-wing and right-wing politics are or what Zionism is. A simple Google search can tell you the commonly accepted meanings of these terms.

            It’s not possible to “love” both the oppressed and the oppressor. Those who claim to be neutral are by default on the side of the oppressor.

            In the specific context of Israel-Palestine, a settler-colonial state is ruling over a population that are not its citizens. This state is settling its own people on land that belongs to the Occupied–land that the entire rest of the world agrees is not Israeli. Leftists stand with the Palestinian people and argue that either there should be two states(which requires the settlers to leave the West Bank) or that there should be one state between the Jordan and the Mediterranean. This one state then has to be secular and democratic with equal rights for all and cannot by definition be Jewish or give Jewish citizens greater rights than non-Jewish ones.

            Rightists admire the muscular nationalism of the Israeli state. This is especially the case with Hindutvadis who see Muslims as the common enemy they share with Zionists and only wish that they could do to Kashmiri Muslims would Israel does to Palestinians.

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    2. Razib
      i just think he thinks that a bit of antisemitism to go along with antizionism might be something u have to tolerate to have solidarity with third world ppl or whatever.

      Assuming, what you say is correct, Corbyn does not know to crunch the numbers. England is still 80% English.
      Anti semitism or pro I dont think is a big issue for the English, specially the working class.

      However, Corbyns stance on war crime investigations for British Troops was probably a bigger factor among the English population. Liberal ideas aside, thats political suicide at the very least among the English population.

      The previous govt in Sri Lanka, specially Ranil Wickremasinghe the PM and Mangala Samaraweera* Foreign minister co sponsored a UNHRC resolution to investigate War Crimes in Sri Lanka.

      No wonder, the Sinhalese (much like the English) crossed traditional party lines to get a huge Presidential Majority.

      *More details on Mangala if interested.

      https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/defence/military-campaigns/news/79293/jeremy-corbyn-backs-war-crime-probes-british-soldiers

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      1. “Anti semitism or pro I dont think is a big issue for the English, specially the working class.”

        Perceptive and agree. Poor, middle class and rich caucasians often have a current of anti semitism. But not nearly as much as Corbyn.

        But I think it was a major factor in why African, Indian, Indian muslim and moderate muslim Britons turned against Corbyn. If Corbyn could turn so rabidly and overtly against a long term loyal Labour constituency (Jewish Britons were loyal to Labour for generations), he could easily turn his anger and bigotry against African, Indian, Indian muslim and moderate muslim Britons too.

        A bigger factor was Corbyn’s long record of backing conservative and Islamist muslims against moderate muslims. Another big factor was that Corbyn has publicly and viciously attacked and slandered India more than any other prominent English politician since 1947.

        “However, Corbyns stance on war crime investigations for British Troops was probably a bigger factor among the English population. Liberal ideas aside, thats political suicide at the very least among the English population.”

        For me this is not the bigger problem. The bigger problem is that Corbyn clearly has a lot of bigotry and anger against the Iraqi Government, establishment and political parties that have ruled Iraq since 2003, the post 2003 Iraqi Army, the post 2003 Iraqi police. Corbyn has often rhetorically favored the Islamists fighting the Iraqi Army and Iraqi Police. Corbyn has often de facto sided with Al Qaeda and Daesh against the Iraqi Army.

        Many Iraqis (in Iraq and in England) detest Corbyn.

        If Corbyn supports war crimes investigations against the Iraqi Army, don’t be surprised if Iraqis want to smack him.

        Corbyn has similarly sided with the Pakistani Army General Headquarters deep state against Afghanistan in the 2001-2019 de facto war between Pakistani GHQ and Afghanistan. Corbyn has sided with Taliban and Al Qaeda linked networks fighting the Afghan National Army.

        Many Afghans do not like Corbyn. Pakistanis often support Corbyn because he overtly sides with Pakistan against Afghanistan and India.

        ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

        “The previous govt in Sri Lanka, specially Ranil Wickremasinghe the PM and Mangala Samaraweera* Foreign minister co sponsored a UNHRC resolution to investigate War Crimes in Sri Lanka.

        No wonder, the Sinhalese (much like the English) crossed traditional party lines to get a huge Presidential Majority.

        *More details on Mangala if interested.”

        I am interested in more details on Mangala. Can you write about him? Did he want to investigate war crimes committed by the Sri Lankan military while fighting Tamil Tigers 2006-2009?

        There are problems with doing this. The military was ordered and allowed to do this by the elected leaders of the Sri Lankan people. A bigger problem is that most Sri Lankan people 2006-2009 appear to have supported these extreme methods.

        It is less the Sri Lankan military’s issue than the moral angst the elected leaders of the Sri Lankan people (2006-2009) and the Sri Lankan people as a whole have about what they thought and supported during the civil war.

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    1. Thanks for sharing A. Karhukainen.
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      Added some new videos to the blogpost.
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      Loved your comment Slapstik!

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  10. Here is a good source for more data on how the vote broke down: https://lordashcroftpolls.com/2019/12/how-britain-voted-and-why-my-2019-general-election-post-vote-poll/

    The Lib Dems went with a policy that would have cancelled the 2016 Brexit referendum which was seen as being undemocratic. Their leader Jo Swinson had very low popularity. And plenty of voters who may have been tempted to go Lib Dem disliked the prospect of a Corbyn government enough to vote Tory.

    There aren’t enough Indians in the UK for there to be much resentment against them, the native British people they compete with for jobs, university places etc. regard racism as declasse and make sure they keep elite jobs with people like them anyway.

    Priti Patel gets hate mail in part because she is seen as a rather vicious right-winger. Obviously the rest is due to her being brown, Tory and a woman. An Australian style points system for immigration has its critics because of the belief it would lead to labour shortages in sectors like construction, nursing, elderly care, agriculture etc. and discriminate against the poor.

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  11. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kf1YKeq7lA
    Interesting.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    “Priti Patel gets hate mail in part because she is seen as a rather vicious right-winger”

    I never heard of her. Why would some consider her “vicious”? Why would she be called “right-wing”?

    +++++++++++++++++++++++
    “There aren’t enough Indians in the UK for there to be much resentment against them”
    UK people don’t like Jews and there aren’t many Jews in the UK. Plus now the highest income group in Britain are Chinese, followed by Indians. Academically Chinese in the UK score off the charts . . . far better than Indians. Indians score better than people with English ancestry (very low bar to be sure).

    Surely this must be well known and be driving a lot of angry xenophobic jealousy from some members of Labour (and some non Labour Englishmen too)?

    “the native British people they compete with for jobs, university places etc. regard racism as declasse”
    What does “declasse” mean?

    “and make sure they keep elite jobs with people like them anyway.” How do they do this? In the US, Asians have penetrated all elite parts of America that don’t have to do with sports, physical fitness, and male physical attractiveness.

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  12. Article updated. African Britons voted against Labour in droves. Will very powerful people who have large concentrations of sub-saharan African DNA admixture haploid groups act similarly around the world? What are the implications of this if they do?

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