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thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago

@Dathang

Sports gene wise, what does GWAS show for different Indian ancestral groups? Like if you were an Indian sports committee chairman, how would you invest funds and into which sports, if genetics is all you were looking at

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

I am not aware about the GWAS stuff on sports across populations. If I were a chairman, I would take random cohorts from various places and test them on various athletic attributes. People are likely not the same everywhere. Some places will turn up with better marathoners, some/others with better long/high jumpers, some/others better at other track and field events, some/others at boxing etc. etc. Based on this, if the p-value is significant over a few years of testing at least, I would weigh allocation of resources for the respective sports. For example, places proven to have more potential for 3,000 meters will get a certain higher percentage of funds for the sport in comparison to the average place.

How well off people are, and how much effort is directed to sports in a place a priori might affect this like Jharkhand putting more effort than Bihar but a sports chairman can only do much.

Brown
Brown
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

rajiv gandhi tried it, by encouraging north eastern tribals to archery, siddis of karnataka for long distance running. things didn’t work out. it was a novel effort.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  Brown

It always saddens me that Gujarat’s only has ever produced a single medalist, Raj Bhavsar, and he did not grow up in Gujarat. I definitely envy the greater sports emphasis in other cultures

brown
brown
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

In Karnataka bhavsars are Marathi taylors.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Interesting. They are also present in Gujarat. Kolis and Kunbis span both places too. Patels, patios, marathas, etc are genetically similar

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Another great Guju descent gymnast is Akash Modi of Stanford. Almost made US Olympic squad.

lurker
lurker
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Raj Bhavsar is not only a Gujarati but also a Jain. From a Times of India article on him: “Raj is the son of Jyotindra and Surekha Bhavsar and has been raised as a devout Jain in Houston”
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/4610633.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst

And it seems Akash Modi is a cousin of Raj Bhavsar, so possibly a Jain too. “… If he makes the Olympic team, he will carry on a family legacy following his second cousin Raj Bhavsar. ..”

Gujarati and Jain Olympians. Culture/Nurture matters.

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago
Reply to  Brown

Sides are Bantu descended aren’t they? Should have tested for a range of different thing in many groups instead of lining people with a couple of sports without testing. Which is the important part- the testing, investment without knowledge is a shot in the dark.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

Should have done sprinting. ACTN3 homozygous testing and myostatin mutation testing

sbarrkum
1 year ago

Unrelated a Friday night comment

Mano Dibango; Soul makkosa. I think some of the first African music I heard (and Osi Bisa). Courtesy of the American Center, then at Galle Face Court.
I had been a long time member of the British Council Library, then in Colpetty. Had been member since the age of ten and possibly below. That was my fathers doing, he enticed me by taking me once or twice and then showing me how to get there by train from koralawella. (about 12 km away00

Anyway around age 13 or so (1974ish) heard about the Amerrican center. So walked,, about a km. Apparently could not become a member till I was 16. A disappointed me who was leaving was told by this ‘”old” gent a kind of minor employee said that i could listen to records and read magazines without becoming a member.
And thats what I did,, listen to records and read magazines every I came to get //return books at BC.

So one of the first, I heard. Mano Dibango; Soul Makkosa.
Hopefully this Link works,
https://www.facebook.com/100014014474339/videos/1121117451832125/?

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Is track and field big in Sri Lanka? Very happy to see a S Asian from there break 10 second barrier

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

thanks warlock..
Is track and field big in Sri Lanka? Very happy to see a S Asian from there break 10 second barrier

Dont know re track and field being big in SL.
That or else is not a big issue for me/

In US when I was fat an overweight (200 lbs and 5’4′) I beat my friend an African American Marathon runner on a short 25 meter run

Wsrlock. I agree much untapped potential. Jeebus, SL is just 22 million compared to India’s 1billion plus.

Hector_St_Clare
Hector_St_Clare
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Sinhalese or Tamil?

Neolithic_Forager
1 year ago

Hey, some questions to Razib (and others)

– Is there strong casteist bias among non Indian South Asian Muslims (born and raised in the west) in the west?

– Has any of you ever experienced subtle casteist behavior from fellow South Asians in the west?

– Is the south asian community in the west very strict towards casteism in the west?

– What are your takes on a study published some weeks ago found Anatolian farmer ancestry in IVCp contradicting Shinde et al that found no Anatolian farmer ancestry in IVCp?

– Does it mean Iran_Chl migrated to South Asia in multiple waves, if IVCp really had Anatolian ancestry? Or this ancestry came from Iran_n not Iran_Chl?

– What modern population of South Asia is closest to Rakhigarhi woman? As per Shinde et al, she had 73% Iranian related ancestry. Is that population, Gujar or Baloch?

– Were Iran_N or Iran_hg present in South India during middle bronze age (2500-3500 BCE)?

– As per your estimate, what would have been population size of Iran_n/hg and steppe pastoralists when they migrated to South Asia? What about the population size of South Asian_hg?

Sumit
Sumit
1 year ago

In hindsight there are were 2 or 3 subtle instances I can recall where Indian fobs subtly asked me (like getting asked my last name at a weird time). But this is very minors and I never felt discriminated because of it.

By contrast my race is written on my face and I have been openly mocked for looking Muslim / Hindu / Indian etc multiple times. And countless subtle jibes. One manager at a previous role joked about me being a rapist during the gang rape publicity in India. I am to an extent perceived as a perpetual foreigner no matter the level of assimilation. This racial stuff is also not THAT big of a deal, but it’s several orders of magnitude more prevalent and severe than caste.

So I am 100000x more concerned about non-Indian / non-Hindu caste Karens, acting from ignorance or bad faith, using caste stuff as a tool for oppressing the uppity Brown.

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago

>– What are your takes on a study published some weeks ago found Anatolian farmer ancestry in IVCp contradicting Shinde et al that found no Anatolian farmer ancestry in IVCp?

Do tell more about it. I have not heard of it.

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago

– What modern population of South Asia is closest to Rakhigarhi woman? As per Shinde et al, she had 73% Iranian related ancestry. Is that population, Gujar or Baloch?

Check her GEDmatch number. I believe it is TP7757435. Some guy posted a harappaworld breakdown on reddit, check it out.
comment image?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=688bd4d71b93f79a54fa1a8a75ad685374038a95

>– Were Iran_N or Iran_hg present in South India during middle bronze age (2500-3500 BCE)?

Iran_N/HG weren’t present in unadmixed forms in all likelihood. But maybe, a population with that ancestry could have migrated. Do I think it did in that time frame? I am not sure, I suspect that the first migration into South India proper of a population carrying that Iran ancestry would have started maybe 3,000 BC at most. To confirm or deny this, you’d need samples older than 3,000 BC from deep in South India like Karnataka, Telangana, Adhra and regions south of it.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

Lol that kit is close to mine and lurker. IVC was jain 😉

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Meat eating Jains. Probably didn’t have plenty of other aspects of the religion as well.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

I was joking. IVC religion probably like most polytheist faiths at the time.

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

Many religions at the time would have been different so ‘most polytheist faiths’ covers a very very broad territory. To zoom in, try and see the distinctions within India. For example, most ivc related goddess-like figurines are from the western zone, possibly from middle eastern influence. So the eastern ivc religion could be more truly native.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  DaThang

True.

Lurker
Lurker
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

The Rakhigarhi woman’s harappaworld breakdown is eerily similar to mine. Same S Indian (mid 40s), NE Euro + Caucasian( low tens), same NE Asian even (3% range, most Indians score lower on this). My Baloch is a couple ppt lower but also in the mid 30s, the difference being made up for mostly by higher SW Asian.

If they find male IVC samples I suspect R2a will be a major haplogroup if not the dominant one

Move away Dravidians, MaruGurjars are the true sons of IVC

H. M. Brough
H. M. Brough
1 year ago

No brown has ever asked or cared my caste. I grew up in a brown ethno-suburb on the West Coast.

A few Whites have made fun of me for being Hindu, some others have thought I was Muslim and made fun of me for that.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago

1. No. There isnt even casteist bias among Hindus that is of any notable significance barring some very exceptional cases. This is all a DEI money scheme and power grab.
2. Yes. Some Jats and Patels. But they form a minority within a minority. The strictest test is endogamy. Those communities pass it the best.
3. Interesting finding. Need more samples
4. Possibly
5. It doesn’t matter too much. She is one individual roughly in the middle of a cline. Indus valley had a cline from 50% aasi to 0% aasi and the rest being Iran Mesolithic HG related. Closest people to Indus Valley are those who have 0 steppe and fall somewhere on the cline. S Indian mid castes, Patels, and Toda are closest. Baloch and Gujar have too much steppe
6. Yes
7. Hard to say but substantial enough to make a genetic impact, so numbers can be disparate but not exceedingly so.

Aditya Ronanki
Aditya Ronanki
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

“2. Yes. Some Jats and Patels. But they form a minority within a minority. The strictest test is endogamy. Those communities pass it the best.”

TamBrahms are pretty bad too. TelBrahms don’t seem as bad by comparison though.

Jatts and Patels get a bad wrap for a bit uncouth and on the nose with their jaativaad. This sort of performative, ritual status-establishing aggression is common among landed Shudras and Kshatriyas. It doesn’t mean that Brahmins and Baniyas are less casteist, they just don’t need to deal with the lowers at the ground level on a day-to-day basis in quite the same way.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Jatt chauvinism in the Greater Toronto Area is in-your-face and disgusting.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  Hoju

There is a huge number of them on reddit. They love genetics subreddits, as expected lol.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

Peggy Lee — Is That All There Is? 1969
Pretty much sums up my philosophy of life, Is That All There Is. Maybe, might have thought different if I was tortured in some prison camp. Who knows, still got a couple of years to go.

Peggy Lee (May 26, 1920 – January 21, 2002), born Norma Deloris Egstrom in Jamestown, North Dakota. Beautiful woman, Beautiful music, wrote her own songs, what more can I say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCRZZC-DH7M

phyecho1
phyecho1
1 year ago

we are living through a crazy period. I guess once a civilization reaches its peak, it can waste away its resources , time, energy on nonsense. Humans are very good at nonsense. I want to fast forward the world by 150 yrs. I expect better things then.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

For those who have forgotten Funk before it was called funk
Ohio Players “Skin Tight” 1974
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qd-2a1MLgc

much later, Sweet Sticky Thing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZKWpTqa2f4

Westt
Westt
1 year ago

Scientists were able to sequence DNA from the Ganga Mesolithic sample. Hopefully that will be our first AASI sample. They were also able to get DNA from South India during the megalithic period (600-1000 BCE). The paper will come out soon.

DaThang
DaThang
1 year ago
Reply to  Westt

Which mesolithic group was it from Damdama? Also will the sample be published with re-checked radiocarbon dates?

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago

30min walk through a Chennai beach festival. Pleasantly surprised by the vibes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9wF-y3-WN8

Roy
Roy
1 year ago

Iran War Next? John Bolton Assassination Hoax and Salmon Rushdie Fatwa Stabbing

https://www.unz.com/aanglin/iran-war-next-john-bolton-assassination-hoax-and-salmon-rushdie-fatwa-stabbing/

HJ
HJ
1 year ago
Reply to  Roy

Occam’s razor tells me this is a random Islamist doing their usual thing.

Vikram
1 year ago

More on Sri Lanka’s high literacy rates before independence, even by 1921 the country had very high literacy rates. So this isnt a 1940s phenomenon. The British seem to somehow prioritized public schooling a lot more in Sri Lanka.

“By 1921, within just 20 years, literacy rates among the island’s male population rose to 66 percent for Christians, 50 percent for Buddhists, 45 percent for Muslims, and 37 percent for Hindus. For women, 50 percent of Christians were literate, while literacy rates among Buddhist, Muslim, and Hindu women rose to 17 percent, 6 percent, and 10 percent, respectively. When independence was granted in 1948, Sri Lanka had 5,895 schools enrolling more than 1 million students. The nation’s literacy rate was 57.8 percent, the highest among both Great Britain’s colonies and Asian nations.”

Read more: Sri Lanka – History Background – Percent, Tamil, Tamils, and Island – StateUniversity.com https://education.stateuniversity.com/pages/1420/Sri-Lanka-HISTORY-BACKGROUND.html#ixzz7brYhdrM3

HJ
HJ
1 year ago
Reply to  Vikram

Sri Lanka was always governed separately from India. Maybe the Brits who ran Sri Lanka cared more about education than the ones who ran India?

Vikram
1 year ago
Reply to  HJ

Yes, this seems to be the case. I think Sri Lanka was a consolidated colony, it encompassed all the strategic and economic value for Britain in a single geographical space. India was different.

Different regions in India were colonized for different reasons and were even governed differently. The coasts were important for trade and considered somewhat livable. The interior was not favored as much, apart from Punjab, and upper tracts of the Ganges basin.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  Vikram

Vikram and HJ
The Bits were not too interested in education for all. They (eg Royal College) or the Anglican Church (eg Trinity, S. Thomas) built elite schools to get Brown Sahibs to be secondary administrators.

The big numbers were from
a) Buddhist Temples/Pirivenas in rural villages that taught basic reading/writing and arithmetic
b) The American Christian Missions and US Buddhist Theosophical Society.

The American Mission were only allowed to operate in the North and East. Huge schools (see Jaffna College) and Hospitals were built. Many Tamils in Jaffna took advantage, got an education and converted. eg My great grandfather. By the next generation his eldest son was married to an American Missionary, Kitty Wood. Grandfathers brother was sent to the Maldives as the Brit Government agent. He and the wife started to translate the Bible into Divehi. Then he got yellow fever and died. The three children left for US. As they landed in US around 1905 all three were children were found to have TB (long ship journey) . All the children died. Wife came back to SL, rejected by family funded and ran an orphanage in the Hill Country.
Note: The American mission activity was only in Jaffna Peninsula and in Batticoloa in the East. The rest of the huge swath of the Vanni remained untouched and even to this day is less well off than Jaffna or Batticoloa.

So the Jaffna Tamils had a huge head start in English education and soon became, Doctors, Engineer and filled the clerical staff of the Brit Admin in then Ceylon Quite a few were recruited to Malaysia and served under the Brits as minor Administrators. Others went independently as lawyers and doctors as there was good money.

Now to the US Buddhist Theosophical Society.
The premier Buddhist schools were founded by them, eg Ananda, Nalanda, Visaka . European secular education, with Buddhist instruction.
By 1935 there were 407,904 children, or 65%, receiving an education in Buddhist schools of which 229 were administered by the Theosophical Society. Even the BUDDHIST FLAG (1886) was designed by the TS. Wesak fullmoon day being declared a public holiday was also TS effort.

==========Links ============
.If you get a chance read White Woman’s Other Burden, Kumari Jayawardena
In The White Woman’s Other Burden, Kumari Jayawardena re-evaluates the Western women who lived and worked in South Asia during the period of British rule. She tells the stories of many well-known women, including Katherine Mayo, Helena Blavatsky, Annie Besant, Madeleine Slade, and Mirra Richard and highlights the stories of dozens of women whose names have been forgotten today. In the course of this telling, Jayawardena raises the issues of race, class, and gender which are part of current debates among feminists throughout the world..
https://www.amazon.com/White-Womans-Other-Burden-Western/dp/0415911052

===========
The Theosophists were for “education for all” as part of their creed of “Universal Brotherhood”. Olcott was dismayed that caste considerations were inhibiting the development of the Karavas, Salagamas and Durawas

Inspired by Theosophists, the Buddhist Defense Committee, the Buddhist Theosophical Society and the Young Men’s Buddhist Association accommodated people from all castes.
https://newsin.asia/role-of-theosophists-in-buddhist-revival-in-ceylon/
=======
Swami Vivekananda was protege Theosophical Society
https://theosophy.wiki/en/Vivekananda
============
Jaffna Tamil refuse to identify themselves with the wider Tamil community. In attempt to express their own identity in Malaysia, Jaffna Tamil have sought to distance themselves from Malaysia’s Indian Tamil community (one and a half million Tamil Indians from Southern India) along class lines.
https://joshuaproject.net/people_groups/19200/MY

Ugra
Ugra
1 year ago

Mohammed Zubair is a Tamilian. He hails from a village near Thally, not far from Hosur and also close to the place where Rajaji (C Rajagopalachari) hailed from.

I have my own doubts about his exact linguistic group. That place is a trijunction between Andhra, Karnataka and Tamilnadu where it is the usual norm to be linguistically fluid. It seems very probable that they are Dakhanis who immigrated recently from the Hyderabad region.

Overall this corresponds with a trend where leading ideologues across the political spectrum are overwhelmingly concentrated within the economically dynamic regions of a nation.

Across the non-political Right, ideologues like Sai Deepak are forming the crux for the next major thrust on the judiciary, the last institutional refuge for Gangetic secularism. While Islamist ideologues like Zubair are also driving globalization strategies using social media.

Within the cultural space, the Telugu film industry is setting the benchmark for native expression on the big screen. It is close to occupying the space vacated by Bollywood (filled with Punjabis and the Gangetic Khans).

The Gujarati focus on mercantilism has had the biggest effect on political patronage for money/trade networks such as UPI, India Stack and ONDC (the next big revolution).

These continue to accelerate the trend of the Indian centre of gravity moving to the Western/Southern regions.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

The request for the Chinese ballistic missile- and satellite-tracking vessel Yuan Wang 5 to call at Hambantota Port for replenishments, which was deferred earlier, has now been granted.

“Having considered all material in place, on August 13, 2022, the clearance to the Embassy of the People’s Republic of China was conveyed for the deferred arrival of the vessel from 16-22 August, 2022,” the statement read further.

http://www.adaderana.lk/news/84286/foreign-ministry-gives-clearance-for-deferred-chinese-vessels-arrival

Bhumiputra
Bhumiputra
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

hmmm. IN ppl and parties will be advised to remember this episode the next time they feel the urge to help our neighbors.

Sumit
Sumit
1 year ago

The indian matchmaking season 2 shows that indian americans generally dont care about caste even in the context of arranged marriages.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Sumit

Even the fob folks don’t care. I would guess there are 5 Indian guys to 1 Indian girl in any US STEM grad program. The competition is too stiff to care about caste.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

The village I live in, Eluwamkulama. 40% Muslim, 40% Sinhalese (mainly catholics) and 205 Tamil. Former border village, many here were killed by the LTTE terrorists.

This is the dry zone of Sri Lsnka, which gets only 3 months of rain a year. 1500-2000mm /per year all in 3 months, just like Tamil Nadu. Lush and green because of the reservoirs built by the Sinhala Kings. This is a minor reservoir, does not get mention in history. 30,000 of these reservoirs all over the dry zone.

Commentary in Tamil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Sdj0gegJ0g

Mobike ride to eluvamkulama, reservoir spillway.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uThYW0UXV24

Gangewadiya, about 7km from where I live.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZFtPyqd-A

The River that borders my property.
Video from nearby USD100/night hotel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzXXmg7pFQk

Prats
Prats
1 year ago

It is interesting that independent India’s greatest socialist leader was a baniya (Ram Manohar Lohia).

I wonder what Saurav has to say on that.

On a related note, it seems to me that baniyas started taking education quite seriously 20-30 years ago. In general, the baniya move towards the world of intellect has been more successful than the Brahmin move towards business.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

Banias are like jews in a some regards. One such regard is a penchant for intellectualism across the political spectrum. Hence, many looney leftists thought leaders are banias.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Aren’t those the Brahmins?

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

@Prats
I do not see any real Brahmin move towards business. A big reason for Bania success has been the JEE/NEET coaching industry centered near their home ground (in Kota). North Indian Baniyas can afford to send their children to coaching for 2-3 years for ~4-6 lakh rupees. Only the government servant bamans can
do the same.

Prats
Prats
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

I do not see any real Brahmin move towards business.

I recently came across a stat that stated that almost 40% of all company board seats in India are held by Brahmins.

A big reason for Bania success has been the JEE/NEET coaching industry centered near their home ground (in Kota).

If you look at UPSC results, you would find a lot of Guptas and Jains too among the top rankers. This wasn’t the case till a few years ago.
Just seems like a natural consequence of living in a knowledge economy. You gotta study to make the big bucks.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

Guptas are mostly banias. Jains mostly are Hindu Bania converts from Rajasthan.

Ugra
Ugra
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

@Prats

I noted one another time that Lohia and JP have been the most influential Gangetic political thinkers who successfully peddled low brow socialism to the UP/Bihar masses. Both of them were educated in the West (Lohia – Germany, JP – USA) and brought back the worst economic philosophy possible!

Together with Nehru’s influence, these gentlemen thoroughly discredited capitalism in the Gangetic hinterland.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago

One of the best podcast episodes / documentaries about India that I have seen. “Vijayanagara – The Last Emperors of South India” from Fall of Civilizations podcast.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlMpxUYKTcU

Stunning visuals of Hampi. It’s 3 hours long.

Starts with ancient / classical India, then the Delhi Sultanate, and then leads to the Vijayanagara Empire, its rise and fall. Didn’t agree with all of it, maybe some smudging when it comes to things like AIT and Islamic conquest, but all in all it is amazing.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

Sri Lanka should be punished for letting the Chinese spy ship dock. These beggars keep provoking India despite so much one sided goodwill for decades now.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

Sri Lanka should be punished for letting the Chinese spy ship dock. These beggars keep provoking India
Sri Lankans, specially the Sinhalese know thats the general thinking among Indians. Sri Lankans should be nice little darkie Dalits who will roll over at India’s bidding.
No question Sri Lankan are little darkie Dalits . However, we dont have 2,000+ years of higher varnas telling us we are stupid and only fit to clean shit. So we know how to play the game.

So we now have China in our corner. I am sure they too think we are dumb little darkies. Thats fine, they can counter balance the Indians and both will fight to give us more goodies.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

It’s rich for you to play the race victim given the severity of Sinhala racism against Tamils. And yes, there are Sinhala supremacists who boast about their racial superiority vis-a-vis the SL Tamils and South Indians.

But ultimately what you propose is a winning strategy for the Sinhala. India will never stop giving the Sinhala state anything and everything it wants. The tail that wags the dog.

Anonymous
Anonymous
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Lmao, bro , The Sinhalese Themselves are descended from Upper Caste Immigrants from Bengal, Tamil Nadu and Orissa. Whom are you fooling by saying we Sinhalese are Very egalitarian ???

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

@Bhim

Not our dog, not our fight…

I am sympathetic to the Sri Lankans. But frankly the game of paying both sides, would not end well. Nepal tried it pretty recently, and India just started ignoring and stopped sending goodies, which brought the Nepalese to their senses, and they soon backed off on their whole border thing and cooled their bravado.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Saurav

I am usually hands-off Sri Lanka camp, I have no beef with them other than this nuclear submarine and spy-ship business. This is them going too far and shows sheer malice and disrespect especially when we have done nothing to provoke them.

Think about it, we pay these losers money to buy fuel and food to eat, and this is what we get in return. We did nothing to hurt them, didn’t fuck with elections, didn’t fuck with their lenders. Even in Nepal’s case it is 2 steps forward (for them) and 1 step back. And I consider Nepalese a far friendlier people than Sri Lankans. Nepalese made a unilateral map at the same time Pakistan made one, included territories they did not even have a claim over in the past. Even if Nepalese talk nice, the map remains. No velvet gloves for any of there folks, fuck them and bring their heel. India has interests, we will pursue them, let this be known.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

Our only interest from SL is that it ports are not used to spy/attack us, especially during war time. And the money we provide is sort of payment for that.

Apart from that there is not much use of Indo-SL relations. Its better to keep a hands off approach. And if the Chinese are willing to pay money to just dock their submarine during a peace time situation, to boost their ego, then i think we shouldn’t begrudge SL fleecing the Chinese a bit.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Saurav

Jal mein rehkar magar se bair …

I don’t think India will let Sri Lanka do this for long. This will have consequences. These things only escalate, and given how shameless, greedy and irresponsible these Sri Lankan losers are they will only use this exception as an excuse the next time it happens. Indian leniency is what got the port sold off to Chinese for 100 years. They knew it was a shitty project, yet they chose to be a sugar baby. I am fine with stupidity, everyone is stupid. But Sell to Arabs, sell to Russians, sell to Americans, sell to anyone other than the Chinese. These Chinese folks will colonize us all one day. But Sri Lankans are a petty scheming people their whole long term deal is to extract rent from their location i.e. trans-shipment from the ‘region’ i.e. India and tourism.

If India is made to choose between safety of Madraas and vanity of SL, the decision is pretty clear.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

Video of woman and house in a very small village Okewela in the deep south.
The woman had worked three years in Lebanon and also in Saudi.
Apparently knows Arabic too.

She the the guy was from Ukraine, though he did not understand.
he is from Azerbaijan

Main point, see the house she has built around 9:20 mins into video.
Partially built.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SudfZ4j4v_0

Another video of woman with running a small food place.
Apparently her house had caught fire and she is in the process of building again.
speaks functional English
The jak fruit is young jak fruit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8aeKLzJah8

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

Rushdie getting stabbed is so sad. It is so hard to keep a balanced view in such situations.

One can argue-debate and what-not but the lasting solution is relentlessly attacking Islam like a sickness. In places like India the process is already on with the ex-muslim movement. China-Russia have their own ways. Westerners are the most creative of us all, I hope they know what they are doing.

Muslim immigrants must be vetted and ones with extremist views must not be allowed in. If such steps are not taken there will eventually be riots for retribution like we see in India.

Pandit Brown
Pandit Brown
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

The right response to Khomeini’s bounty on Rushdie would have been to declare a bounty on him in return. The British govt (I think Rushdie was a British citizen then) should have told Khomeini: “if Rushdie dies, so do you”. If leaders of countries want to behave like mob bosses, they should be treated as such.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

The reaction on social media from the Muslim world was sad and enraging. Many prominent accounts (and an endless sea of less prominent ones) were openly celebrating and adding more names to the kill list. Twitter made no efforts to clamp down on these overt death threats since the DNC / Left always looks the other way (and sometimes even encourages and justifies) when it comes to Islamic extremism.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

Happy Independence Day.
Jai Hind.

Something Telugu cinema should come up with is simple (i.e. excellent hindi lyrics), patriotic songs that can be played on 2, 15, and 26. Same old ‘Ae mere watan ke logon…’, ‘Vande mataram’ (Rehman), … have been playing for 20+ years now. Will win Telugu actors enormous goodwill in UP-Bihar, National days are a big deal in small towns and villages here where school-events are the only ‘entertainment’ in town.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

‘Happy Independence Day.’

Annual Bengali and Punjabis rona dhona ceremony.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Saurav

Mostly it is Punjabis because their language and manner of speech is high on exaggeration and hyperbole.

(Dumb) Sikh Punjabis remember Khalsa-Raj and (Dumb) Muslim Punjabis think of their majority.

Not the same in Bengal. Refugees from Bangladesh, especially folks in Siliguri-Assam, fucking hate Bangladeshi Muslims and say so openly.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao
Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

https://www.dawn.com/news/1704682/the-sad-story-of-the-rejection-of-science

Pakistan sucks.

India sucks but not at the same level. Even to whiners like myself India offers some carrots like a job at Google/Samsung/MS research in Hyd/Blr or at TIFR/IISc/ISI/(old)IITs, plenty of other top places like AMD/Intel/Nvidia/… in Blr.

Can’t think of any reason why any talented Pakistani, attending grad school in the US, would ever want to go back to their shitty country.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

warlock
Is track and field big in Sri Lanka? Very happy to see a S Asian from there break 10 second barrier
spoke to a classmate who is big into athletics. He says there is a system put into place, now about 50 years. There are school level events. They become spring boards to district level events at Under 12. Then onto National Events and then South Asian games.
Since about 2012 or so after the war ended to integrate the Vanni into the system. The vanni is the area that was under LTTE control . Took a while as first the infrastructure needed to be built. Roads, schools and grounds etc.
It was only recently it has paid off, they are seeing Tgirls shining at National event.
If you start shining at national events, that means easy entry into big company or the Army, Air Force.

Its pretty much the same as for cricket. But because the potential for big money lot of intereference from high ups and politicians.
Prior to 80’s all cricketers were from elite English speaking schools. It was only after rural school cricketers (eg Sanath Jayasuriya) started get into SL team did we win test matches. Now the problem is political interference.

I think the key point is there is hidden talent even in the boonies. It has to bee found and fostered and the nation benefits.

reminds me of
Full many a gem of purest ray serene,
The dark unfathom’d caves of ocean bear:
Full many a flower is born to blush unseen,
And waste its sweetness on the desert air.

The flowers and gems need to be found and appreciated

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Meet Kalaiyarasi Sadasivam. This 15-year-old girl, like thousands from her country Sri Lanka, loves cricket. She has been selected for Sri Lanka’s provisional Under-19 squad.

What marks Kalaiyarasi apart is that she is already breaking down barriers for people in her community by being the first Tamil girl to enter the national cricketing arena.

Kalaiyarasi hails from Kilinochchi, in Sri Lanka’s north. For years, this region was ravaged by the civil war. Opportunities and facilities for budding

https://www.thehindu.com/sport/cricket/school-girl-from-sri-lankas-north-breaks-cricketing-barriers/article65520366.ece?homepage=true

I think Kilinochi and the greater North abd East is going to be big talent pool for sports.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Thanks for info. On an unrelated note, why is Sri Lankan cricketer accent less thick compared to Indian counterpart. I noticed this in post match press interviews.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

The Hindu article shows a destroyed water tower and implies Kilinochi is some kind of wasteland.

Kilinochi, was the LTTE capital. The water tower, reservoirs and town was destroyed by the LTTE as they retreated.

one of the first thing the Army did after the town was captured was to build temporary water towers. Now some brand new water towers.
https://www.ft.lk/News/Sierra-Construction-builds-15-water-towers-in-Jaffna-and-Kilinochchi/56-661713

You can judge if Kilinochi is a wasteland
kilinochi Town
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGdtSW80oFY

phyecho1
phyecho1
1 year ago

30 yrs, 15 to 20 trillion dollar economy. Followed by military tech. That is what matters most. Asking or aiming for anything else is wasting time, energy, emotions etc. A politics that is ruthless in its logic with a velvet gloves covering it.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago

‘It is interesting that independent India’s greatest socialist leader was a baniya’

Well there are black sheeps in each community. 90 percent of all Baniyas vote BJP. But then we do have Tanuja gupta, No?

On a side note, Baniyas are curios mix of being both a economical strong caste with next to nil political significance. So they hitch their bandwagon to whichever ‘ideology’ gives them power , and fast. During the 90s they quickly bankrolled the RJB movement. Similarly after the death of Nehru, Lohia saw an opening and captured the ‘socialist’ space to gain power. So no surprises there…

principia
principia
1 year ago

Interesting ranking of countries with most highly cited papers (1%).

https://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/14691980

It’s only in STEM. India is now ranked above SK and Japan and sits at #7 in the world. As late as a decade ago, it wasn’t even in the top ten. Unsurprisingly, China is now #1.

Translating research papers into commercial success is a completely different skillset and one in which the US holds the overwhelming advantage. What we’ve seen so far from China hasn’t been too impressive. Let’s see how India fares.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  principia

In biology/medicine, there is a major lag time between basic science to clinical trial success to commercial success. The key is leading basic success and going from there. I think it’s too early to judge how well China has turned its basic success into commercial success

Sumit
Sumit
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

One roadblock is VCs are all quite scared of investing in China after it started reigning in its equivalent of big tech and semi-nationalizing companies which become too big.

The VC business model relies on a very tiny number of big wins to offset many loosing investments, so effectively the risk / reward just isn’t there (esp in current climate but even otherwise)

But who knows, it is possible China will stumble upon a better capital allocation solution that is less skewed in terms of inequality, and granting too much power to big tech companies while still incentivizing impactful investments.

Anyways pleasantly surprised to see India have such a big improvement.

Vikram
1 year ago
Reply to  principia

China’s papers tend to be have only senior researchers as authors. The classic US academia brilliant grad student first author, professor second author combo seems to be missing.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

@Prats

Since 1990s, Baman hold over universities has been broken by Mandal quotas and merit based entrances (backed by coaching industry). Bania fortress of business has only become stronger since liberalization. Bamans outnumber Banias in PhD programs in the US, mostly because of cultural reasons. There is over representation of bakchod folks like TamBrams, Bhadraloks, UP-Bamans, …

I think even UPSC has got a lot to do with coaching industry. Only folks who can stay unemployed in Rajindernagar for 3-5 years get in. Banias have more money so they can afford it.

Director posts, MBA/consulting type bakchodi is right up baman alley. The real prize is small and medium businesses that sustain the country. Bottling plants, transport, gas agencies, edible-oil/sugar industry, retail,… Bamans just don’t do these things. Other than IT either they are babus, peons or farmers.

Prats
Prats
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

It doesn’t seem to me that there are a lot of UP Brahmins in higher academia anywhere. They are the black sheep of the Brahmin family.

You would, though, find a lot of UP Brahmins working as janitors or security guards in Bangalore or Mumbai.

Maybe because there are far more UP Brahmins than other breeds.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

UP Brahmins also have to muscle in power politics in UP, so they engage in same ‘lowly’ work as other castes.

Brahmins in other areas have seceded from politics in other areas (largely) so they moved to private space entirely (Education, Business etc)

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

‘UP Brahmins working as janitors or security guards in Bangalore or Mumbai’

This reminds me a Tomara rajput ward boy (in his late 40s) who resented a Dalit doctor (in her 30s) who was treating my family members during delta wave. The guy was mostly assigned to cleaning and resented working under her because of her caste. She was very rude to me and I would think would have been a complete bitch. This Tomara fellow would recite from the Ramcharitmas to show off his ‘higher’ status whenever he had to show even though professionally he was low he was ritually ‘high’. I had always seen Kshatriyas to be very religious almost reaching Baman fanaticism for purity and spectacle in yajnas but without the dietary restrictions of the Baniyas. But on seeing that ‘lowly’ ward-boy thakur, it finally dawned on me how Kshatriyas were just a version of Brahmins and vice-versa. Baman-Baniya-Thakur are one and the same, they will amalgamate within a few generations.

Janamejaya
Janamejaya
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

“Baman-Baniya-Thakur are one and the same, they will amalgamate within a few generations.”

Why not extend it to OBCs and Dalits too. The Thakur ward-boy and Dalit Doctor dynamic is recreated with OBCs vs Dalits or Dalits vs Tribals or even with intra OBC/Dalit rivalry. Everyone has a place in the ritual ladder, socio-economic ladder, power ladder etc and the ladders do not overlap. Everyone has someone to kick down and others to envy.

IMO, all Hindu castes are very similar, normalized by region. Same people, same mentality, same ethos. Differences are superficial at best but because of little real achievements people hold onto these differences very dearly.

Urbanization and capitalism is melting away caste but I do think it will remain salient for a long time yet. There are just too many Indians around.

Sumit
Sumit
1 year ago
Reply to  Janamejaya

Excessive pride in group identity is often a cope for lack of individual accomplishment.

Better to strive to become the sort of individual your group can be proud of.

SK
SK
1 year ago
Reply to  Janamejaya

@ Sumit

“Excessive pride in group identity is often a cope for lack of individual accomplishment.

Better to strive to become the sort of individual your group can be proud of.”

Good perspective. To extend this further, as we continue to modernize and start climbing the ladder of achievement as a country which is only possible when a critical mass of Indians accomplish the same individually and consistently across the spectrum of collective identities, the salience of caste is bound to diminish. Then whether casteism is demolished or is driven below surface would become nothing more than semantics

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

https://twitter.com/Astro_Raja/status/1558951198656499714?cxt=HHwWhMC4oeD2wKIrAAAA

‘On Indian Independence eve I’m reminded of Indian diaspora that I could see from @Space_Station where my immigrant father’s home town of Hyderabad shines bright. @nasa is just 1 place Indian Americans make a difference every day. Looking forward to @IndianEmbassyUS celebration’

@Ugra
Bhai when is our own Space Station coming up. Banao BC Madraasiyon yeh sab jaldi se hamara khudka. Itna time kyu lag raha hai? Gaganyan keeps getting delayed.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

Madrasi have forgotten their role. They want to act brawny now , they don’t get that’s our job. Their job is to the moolah for the country

Ugra
Ugra
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

Madrasis busy with Aamka. No time for peaceful space stations. SSLV also far more important. PFBR and IPHWR-700 fleet mode also. And a 80 kn turbofan by 80th birthday.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Ugra

@Ugra

IPHWR-700 is being built in numbers that make sense, makes me so happy. Each of these reactor is 100s of good engineers added to the workforce. Please post something about IPHWR-700, I am getting old listening about the fast breeder coming up, it just keeps getting delayed.

I never took any energy and power courses or bother to pick up their texts. Don’t really understand the field. Have zero clue about nuclear beyond the very basic UG 1st year stuff. I don’t care about the endless caste or AIT-OIT or genetics discussions. Please post something covering the current state of the affairs of Indian civil nuclear program focusing on what our own Madraasis have been up to in a language that an engineer from a different field can understand. I don’t give a shit about Amreeki-Euro-Rusi maal, our purchases keep their engineers employed at the cost of jobs in India. Fuck their expensive stuff.

How will the turbofan happen? I kind of get the basics of what they do at a 2nd-3rd year thermo course level, I remember solving textbook Brayton cycle problems but that was years ago. What has India cracked now that was unavailable earlier. I remember going to a big museum of science and tech in the US and looking at the intricacies in the cross section of a modern jet engine turbine blade and thinking India will not be able to make this for decades. What has changed? Have we cracked the engine core materials?

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago

Just saw Jai Bhim on Amazon. Really tough to watch, but great movie.

Phyecho1
Phyecho1
1 year ago

So, had a discussion with a family member telling a bit about Islam and true source of problem. And he confessed to being a coward who will be submissive. Is very much the secular type. It is fair to code secular =islamocowardice.

All of it is cowardice masquerading as morality /empathy, minority rights claptrap.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago

Nepal may be the most beautiful region in the subcontinent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGSYDpvIEno

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago

https://www.livemint.com/opinion/columns/how-the-country-s-middle-class-came-to-be-so-patriotic-11660580047350.html

‘I don’t know about India in its early years after independence, but I can tell you that in the 1980s, most Indians I came across were not patriots. People felt stronger about their religion, language and their castes, if they belonged to upper-caste communities, than about their Indianness. We did not think very highly of ourselves. We were expected to ‘love’ India, somehow, and also flee India. It is not that we felt nothing. No doubt we wanted India to win a cricket match (though in Madras, you could not be sure of this when India played West Indies).

How did this happen? It is not as though India became impressive in any special way. In fact, since the 80s, even though India has progressed, the Asian developing world has left us far behind. India continues to be a difficult place. The best thing money and success can buy is still a golden visa out of here. So what made us patriotic?

We can understand the process through four people all of us know.

One: that new non-resident Indian (NRI).

Two: that urban villager.

Three: that anti-Left guy.

Four: that defeated intellectual.

The first time I met a person who truly loved his nation was a Sri Lankan refugee. This was in the 1980s, when his nation was being destroyed by a civil war. Maybe you have to lose your nation to love it somewhat. Or maybe patriotism was always only a form of mourning that the world misunderstood as adoration.

Vikram
1 year ago
Reply to  Saurav

It is commensurate with the rise in literacy and access to knowledge. Our education system is quite nationalistic, I still remember my shock when I learned that foreigners did not call India’s anti-colonial movement, the freedom struggle. There is genuinely a lot to be proud of.

I dont know why Manu pulls NRIs and intellectuals into everything. Idea that anyone outside Bengal and Kerala paid attention to leftist intellectuals is laughable.

principia
principia
1 year ago

I think the author has several blindspots.

First, India is not an exception but the rule. As countries become more powerful, patriotism/nationalism tends to rise. Even if India is still a poor country, it is already a Great Power and is set to become more powerful. People enjoy being part of a powerful political entity. Breaking off on your own would now be a net negative even for the most developed states.

Second, as Indians became less insular in the 1990s and onwards, I suspect there was a bifurcation. Liberals become even more cosmopolitan and less India-centric leftists (e.g. non-aligned movement no longer popular) but right-wingers started to appreciate their uniqueness even more. In a globalised world, you have to latch onto your identity even more fiercer to keep it.

Third, the author’s upper-middle class milieu was never very representative. BJP has won over the OBCs in a way that they failed in the 1980s and 1990s. Many of the more successful “noveau riche” OBC types have become big supporters of the BJP. This can come across as crass to established cultural elites, but it surely also affects the rest.

All in all, the very peculiar Indian “upper-middle class leftist” that dominated West Bengal and some southern states like Tamil Nadu were always the outliers. It’s amazing they held onto their cultural power for so long. Indian elites are still liberal, but there is a greater acceptance of talking frankly about the negative effects of the Islamic invasions etc. The cultural hand-me-downs from cultural Marxists like Romila Thapar was a phase that is thankfully never coming back. It seems the author still mourns that.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago

30 minute evening walk at Marine Drive in Mumbai.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQINAGuleoU

Mumbai is really in a class of its own when it comes to Indian cities.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago

I think the NRIs does protest too much.

Its no shame in admitting that most of the upper-middle class (which also makes the bulk of NRIs) were hardly patriotic/nationalistic. Add to that the less-Hindu regions, and you get a majority of India growing up the 70s and 80s hardly identifying themselves as Indian, as soon as they stepped out of India.

When the NRIs and current upper-middle class are reminded of that fact, they deflect by saying ‘Oh it was just Bengal/South’ (as if these regions are not Indian) . The ironic part is even today when leftist and commies govern more than 1/3rd of India, we still relegate these views as fringe.

All in all, India’s patriotism/nationalism(right or wrong) is co-terminus with its ‘Hindu’ regions. The higher the ‘Hindu’ quotient, the more patriotic the regions is. Of course, we all know the regions by now 🙂

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Saurav

Madraasis (except maybe Kaanadas, the absolute worst are Telugus) and Bengalis are the worst when it comes to bleaching their innards and trying to be a coconut. Have seen dozens of examples from these ethnicities desperately trying to be Americans at any cost to their self-respect. Folks scheming for a US job or visa as if their whole life depended on it.

I like Telugu simplicity and work-ethic but America or IITs are not worth such lobotomy. Sad bit it that their parents and family in India too pushes them to act like this, as if their own lives and identity are trash and worthy of sacrifice. Marriage negotiations of Telugu guys in the US with a Telugu girl in India are depressing. Their lives, choices and world view sucks.

I suppose Gujjus and Punjabis lied, schemed and ‘married’ their way in too but that was decades ago and I only ever meet their ABCD 2nd gens. I just don’t find ABCDs relatable. Their ideas don’t resonate with me.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

Bhimrao and Saurav
Back to the Chinese ship docking and India protesting.

Initially SL govt deferred to India and asked China to delay ship. Then Blinken ordered SL Foreign minister Ali Sabry to make sure the Chinese ship did not dock. I assume that set off alarm bells, and the Chinese was given permission to dock. SL may be be a piddling little country, but does not rollover to big bullies.

One must remember, that Sri Lanka won the 30 year war against the LTTE terrorists with Chinese money and arms. Thats the war as a result of India training, funding, providing arms and safe haven to the LTTE terrorists. Of course it turned out the lTTE Tamils were Sri Lankan, not like Indian Tamils, servile and ready to orders from India or anyone for . They chased out the Indian army while killing a few thousand soldiers (note: LTTE must have been at most few hundred). worse, they went onto Indian soil and assassinated Rajiv Gandhi. I doubt if India got humiliated to that extent even by Pakistan.

The Port Project was first offered to India. They refused and China jumped in.
The project was started in 2008 and first phase was opened in 2010

In 2015 US and India colluded and funded to defeat the China/Russia leaning Rajapakses. The liberal West leaning UNP of Ranil Wickremasinghe won with a small majority. The new govt needed raise foreign exchange in order to repay maturing sovereign bonds unrelated to the port. The West or India was not will to fork money out. So the West leaning PM who had bad mouthed the Chinese bum sucked.
The Chinese had not forgotten, they wanted their pound of flesh, the Port. Talk about unintended consequences of India and US interfering in SL elections.

Many Indians specially those living in the West think the US is a natural ally of the US/UK (high steppe illusions), The natural allies of the US are other countries of Anglo Saxon origin, such s UK, Aus and Canada. India was ecstatic about joining the Quad and participated in Naval exercises. Then reality set in, AUKUS partnership was formed and plans to have nuclear submarines in Perth Port. Egg on face of India that was hoping for a couple of nuclear subs. Cant give brown coolies, nuclear subs noh.
Also a reminder, during the Bangaladesh war, the US was on Pakistans side. They were in the process of sending a US navy fleet to side with Pakistan. The then PM Indira called Russia and they deployed warships from Vladivostok. The US backed off.

India, is just a pawn to the US. what US would like is goad India in getting into war with China. Just like Ukraine got goaded into provoking Russia. Two birds with one stone. An India China war will slow or stop India (more so) and Chinas development.

The Chinese have some basic principles about other countries sovereignty. Unlike India or US sneaky tactics like funding terrorism and regime change. Note China has not funded or trained terrorists of Assam or Arunachal Pradesh. It would be quite easy to do so, with just a few million.

So, Bhimrao I just observe and comment as I see it. I dont know anyone in the higher echelons of power in SL, neither do I want to know.
So Bhimrao, good luck with your advise of asking India to “punish” Sri Lanka. More power to you and India.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Indias gift of a Dornier reconnaissance aircraft to Sri Lanka arrived on the same day the Chinese ship docked.

I was reminded of “Beware of Greeks Bearing Gifts” a quote from famous ancient literature.

fragment_and_activities
fragment_and_activities
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

> Note China has not funded or trained terrorists of Assam or Arunachal Pradesh. It would be quite easy to do so, with just a few million.

I wonder where the Naga rebels get their guns from.

India should have never lent Sinhalas a single rupee. Sri Lankans have some little boy syndrome.

Brown
Brown
1 year ago

one should concede that modi’s political brain works overtime. the fact that he dropped shivraj and gadkari, ( elections in their states are bit away) and pulled in yeddi is a masterstroke.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Brown

Gadkari is a lightweight who was on BJPs panel just because he is an RSS man. Now with junior Gadkari (Fadnavis) in the helm in the state, there is no use of Gadkari. This could be his last ministerial stint. Same with Shivraj, but with no ready replacement (OBC CM) , he might be given a long rope.

Yeddi has been pulled into the centre to get him away from the state, where he seems to undercut Bomai. Modi himself was a victim of that once.

brown
brown
1 year ago

modi’s or whoever’s idea of giving d d a houses to rohingyas was ???!!!!.
the base will not allow modi to become a secular messaih.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

@Qureshi

https://www.reddit.com/r/pakistan/comments/wpr3v0/shehbaz_gill_was_stripped_naked_and_tortured_says/

‘Shehbaz Gill was stripped naked and tortured, says Imran Khan’

I had predicted this months ago. Specifically I had said Shahbaz Gill should be easy picking as he has no real base.

Just listen to what Imran says in Hindi 😂! Hilarious😆.

I don’t think too highly of Imran but he is a relatively honest man. The problem with him is that he is too nice to actually enforce. PTI needed it’s own Rana-Sanaullah/Amit-Shah.

principia
principia
1 year ago

The torturing of Shehbaz Gill seems like an insanely stupid overreach. The army’s reputation will only take a further hit. Bajwa isn’t ruthless, he’s just being stupid.

Making a martyr out of your opponents is just about the dumbest move you could make.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  principia

But Shahbaz has no real on ground support, there are no folks who will riot on streets and meet baton charges in the open for their ‘leader’. Folks say he is an American citizen. In him I see the naked stupidity of Pakistani (expat) hubris and tall-talk.

Shahbaz is a regular overconfident Pakistani troll who has snaked his way up the cracks of American society. I don’t respect Dr. Gill because his academic appointment at UIUC has come most likely from long term ass-licking at UIUC and not merit or open competition. For over a decade he was their post-doc, lecturer and now a non-tenure ‘clinical’ assistant professor. I seriously look down on such incestuous appointments. Every American university department has such laggards. If someone is worthy then prove it in the open market without support of godfathers.

sbarrkum
1 year ago

warlock
why is Sri Lankan cricketer accent less thick compared to Indian counterpart. I noticed this in post match press interviews.

Kumar Sangakara is elite familiy and school.
Russell Arnold is Protestant Jaffna Tamil* though Colombo born and bred , so neutral accent, I think. *(relative connected in many ways)

About rural others may be they pick up the neutral accent / pronunciation associating with the Colombo clubs guys.

Kumar Sangakkara Interview
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLNMoWBpslA

Russel Arnold
Speaking in Tamil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihyO4E24fa8
In English
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ijzXov-aoI

Sanath Jayasuriya from medium size deep south Sinhala school;
To me he slips on and off with rural pronunciation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3f5YAbuGtM

Sri Lanka, I call it Heaven on Earth – Wasim Akram
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihyO4E24fa8

sbarrkum
1 year ago

I was just thinking, Sri Lankan blue collar workers working overseas are kind of like the Brit Colonialists workers.

Many only see those like Robert Clive who ransacked India. Even the rank and file of Brit India and Ceylon (the equivalent of SL/Indian expat blue collar) gained handsomely by salaries and pensions.

One thing that could be said of the Brits, almost none wanted become Indian.
Unhappily, Indians (and Sri Lankans) want to be Americans and Brits.
Servile people or what.

So back to “Sri Lankan blue collar workers working overseas”, just making use of opportunities. Not because SL has the ability to dictate any policy.

IsThisReal
IsThisReal
1 year ago

Glad to see tons of people on the right openly criticizing Bilkis’ rapists being released and welcomed.
Reasons like these are why I have never voted, and will probably never vote. Every other politician is nothing more than a degenerate. You pretty much need to be a thug (or have their support) to be a politician in most places. Hindus deserve better representation.

And milords deserve to have their teeth kicked in at this point. Terrible judgments every single day. Lost count.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  IsThisReal

It’s the Gujarat model.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  IsThisReal

Fidelity to rule of law application for clearly documented heinous crimes like these is low hanging fruit for the BJP. Absolutely moronic behavior

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago

The only Sri Lankan, Indians care about is Jacqueline Fernandez

Ugra
Ugra
1 year ago

@bhimrao

We figured out some important things in the last 50 years, a rarity outside the UNSC. Even Japan and Australia are laggards when it comes to thorough exploitation of nuclear tech –

1. To set up nuclear plants far away from the Coal Ground Zero in Bihar/Jharkand – this maximises the resource efficiency of the whole electrical grid in terms of transmission and competing sources for baseload supply.

2. Mastery of PHWR tech – which is the most natural fit for us given our nuclear ore resources. PHWR uses natural U as fuel – Bhabha set this course with the negotiations with Canada. If we had chosen LWR, we would have entered an endless cycle of fuel-dependency (enriched U) from others.

3. Sizing – We have figured out a best-fit at 700MWe and 2000MWTh/per reactor for operations. The trick is then to set up many reactors at the same site (Kakrapar, Kaiga etc.)

4. Vajpayee and MMS started a synchronised jugalbandi that threatened the nuclear ayatollahs in the West with breakout proliferation, culminating in the nuclear deal. We capped some military reactors but overall we have now tremendously increased access to uranium (natural and enriched).

5. The nuke SSBN fleet (LWRs) is on track (2 in the water and 2 in the shed). The SSN fleet will follow, far easier to design and construct. In this regard, we are the only non-US member in the QUAD that operates nuclear submarines today. Japan/Australia may get them but they will be effectively US controlled.

6. The PFBR is, perhaps, being purposefully delayed to meet some unknown strategic timeline – either the arrival of plutonium generators (like the 10 PHWRs) or to safeguard the strategic stock of fissile plutonium for submarine warheads.

The net result is that – we have gone from 100 MW of commercial nuclear power in 1972 to over 7000 MW in 2022 – a CAGR of almost 9% – while retaining strategic autonomy. If we hold the same rate for the next 25 years, we will be at 70000 MW in the year 2047.

principia
principia
1 year ago

Feel there’s too much focus on unicorns in the West (and in India) without asking “for what”. Quality over quantity. Ecommerce, social media, fintech start-ups are all vacuous nonsense.

The Chinese are cracking down on these types of start-ups and redirecting funds towards actual engineering projects and companies doing hard science stuff (rockets, semiconductors, materials science, AI, quantum computing etc).

There’s probably too much ideological baggage to do something similar but we could need it. I just roll my eyes whenever I see people yapping about “web3”.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  principia

It looks that way on the outside but then some of the web3 yada-yada folks actually do something very-very useful. Online payments in India was unthinkable 10 years ago. I remember the Razorpay guys being seen as somewhat losers ~7 years back, but now here we are 9-5-ing in Bay Area while they are billionaires. I had another couple of friends, quite talented, who yapped about autonomous driving, then yapped about ML based X-ray annotation. Had some basic products ready but never got anywhere even after 2 years full time pitching in Blr-Hyd. Finally moved to the US for graduate degrees. Raising VC money is hard, generating revenue is impossibly hard.

No point complaining about them. VC is not government money and no one but the VCs should have any say over it. If someone thinks their ideas and instincts are divine they should prove it and then make a VC fund for hardtech from their own money.

Prats
Prats
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

I somewhat agree with Principia’s point here. Something Sumit alluded to above as well.

VC is just one way of allocating capital in a society and a very inefficient one at that.

What you want at the end of the day is economically sustainable innovation that can make people’s lives better, whatever way you define it – create jobs, create missiles, self-reliance etc.

“VC is not government money and no one but the VCs should have any say over it.”

The largest LPs are sovereign funds and pension funds. They do often dictate where the money goes indirectly through policies like ESG.

The laconic VC on Twitter is mostly a service worker in this capital allocation game. We don’t need to give them more importance than they deserve.

“If someone thinks their ideas and instincts are divine they should prove it and then make a VC fund for hardtech from their own money.”

Free markets are useful but let’s not buy the American kool aid on this stuff. Governments can and do influence where money goes. Especially any government in an industrialising country. Even the US is doing the same with things like Inflaction Reduction Act.

America has far too much excess capital. So it can afford to throw it on frivolous things. Great for them.
The sheer volume of deal making ensures that for a hundred ‘Yo’ messengers, they will also throw out a Tesla.

We would be suckers to play the same game mindlessly.

Also, I’d suggest that if you live in Bay Area and earn a few hundred thousand dollars a year then direct some of that as angel funding to your friends in Blr-Hyd trying to do hard tech startups. You can become part of some syndicates on AngelList.

There is a growing cohort of young folks who are remaining in core engineering and doing startups there thanks to the EV revolution. Hope that has a flywheel effect.

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

@Prats Bhai,
What I said is my cope to make sense of the world. I know that advertising technology and network effects are nothing compared to things like electric airplanes. I feel excited about solving real problems and have lost out on a lot of hard cash by trying to build things rather than do tech enabled marketing.

“What you want at the … create missiles, self-reliance etc.”

I just want Indians to have money rest will follow. Poverty sucks.

Heart of the problem is that some new, small, and cheap interventions make lives of millions of people better and it’s founders get paid billions for it. Most hard tech (except Semiconductors or Biotech at the very limits of engineering) does not do it. Zoom meeting beats aviation, Google map saves more fuel than the best engineer at Ford. No one dislikes hard tech, but if hard tech does not make money it is hard to justify spending on it.

Academia and R&D is chock full of chutiya pretenders who will never do anything meaningful but get by with ‘Oh I am doing hard tech’.

“The laconic VC … they deserve.”

I give them their lane as I give banking, insurance, and investment professions their lane. People trust them with money, they must be somewhat competent.

“Free markets … Reduction Act.”

I would never say that, Indian government should do what Indian government must. I fully support things like spending on indigenous rail, roads, nuclear, aero, … but the truth is Indian government and Indian people are not serious or worthy. They will talk tall about startups, hand out 5 crores a year to build fission reactor fitted into a reusable rocket and then give away 5 billion USD of free electricity for votes.

Yeh desh chutiya hai, iske logg gandu hain.

I have a front row seat to the American startup scene. These people are very professional and wicked smart. They just put on this nautanki with t-shirts, pyjama and chappal look. All of it is curated.

“Also, I’d suggest … AngelList.”

Few hundreds ke liye bhai Google ki gaand chatni padegi. Abhi I am taking some chances at smaller place. Dekhte hain kya hota hai.

Kiya tha maine bhi contribute bohot thoda sa, I had very limited means . These two guys had raised USD 30-35K in seed from friends and family. Paid their bills for 2 years.

Syndicate ki aukaat hai nai yaar meri, I just don’t have that kind of money. India ke launde BC chutiya se pitch ka USD 5 million valuation mangte hain. Yeh mere chutiye dost khud USD 1.5 million ka valuation bata rahe the. Main bola, gandu kaunsi charas kari hai tune? Basically na paisa hai, na connections, na skills to be a angel. Abhi nai hoga yeh wala.

Baki yaar ab dekho kya hota hai. Mann toh hai mera khud kuch karne ka.

‘There is … effect.’

Doing startups in the US?

SK
SK
1 year ago
Reply to  Prats

Govt should not be allowed to touch private money. They have tax resources to do their own thing. At best they can incentivize certain fields and nothing more.

Otherwise we will end up pauperized.

HJ
HJ
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

The average 2nd gen Indian American (if even aware of this) will blame it on white supremacy.

Sumit
Sumit
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

These Western leftists and Khalistanis are strange bedfellows with right wing Hindutva nationalists in their hate for Gandhi.

Seems every corner of the political compass hates Gandhi, but he is beloved by the center.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  Sumit

The Indian RW’s hatred for Gandhi is unparalleled. It’s really sickening how they speak of him. They are deeply ashamed of him, they feel he emasculates them. They revere violent nationalists like Bhagat Singh to compensate and provide support for their muscular nationalism.

It’s pathetic.

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  Sumit

Moderate Muslims of Pak even denigrate him quite a bit. To them, he is a caricature of the skinny, weak but conniving “Hindu Baniya” they so love to put down in their media.

Specifically, in the subcontinent, whose entire independence from the British he worked for, only the Indian center right to center left like him. He still has a good reputation in the West. MLK and Mandela giving him props makes a huge difference. It puts Wokes in a bind and forces them to reconcile with Mahatma’s views evolving, instead of just zoning in purely on his time in S Africa.

He was too pacifist for my taste. But collective action can work, when one has a huge population majority like British Indians did over their colonizers. This was part of Malcom X’s critique of MLL using Gandhi’s strategy. Even have gave props to Gandhi, but he recognized the American Black situation was different.

Gandhi’s personal behavior with his nieces was unacceptable. His refusal to give his wife treatment was even worse. But I think on balance, he did some incredible things.

Watch “Rapes but saves” comedic sketch by Dace Chappelle. He hilariously illustrates a paradigm to reconcile historical leaders arguably doing overall societal good but having some clearly documented personal demerits.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

next is chaps like Hoju, Tamil supremacists knocking down Nehru family statues.
Heck Hoju was happy that his beloved LTTE murdered Rajiv Gandhi .

Bhimrao
Bhimrao
1 year ago

and others,
Happy Janmasthami!

There is a open competition going on in my family WhatsApp for the best dressed baby Krishna. Seen more than half a dozen of little boys dressed as Govinda since morning, lots of gopis too. A Sikh neighbor’s 2 year old son was dressed up as a Gopi.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  Bhimrao

“ A Sikh neighbor’s 2 year old son was dressed up as a Gopi.“

Hindu nationalism on the rise 😉

J T
J T
1 year ago

Meanwhile, climate changes marches on. This year we are seeing simultaneous droughts that are impacting the Colorado, Rhine, Danube, and the Yangtse. The situation on the Yangtse is most alarming because of the shear # of people impacted and the larger political impact since massive project for transferring water from Southern China to the parched North. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South%E2%80%93North_Water_Transfer_Project ]

I expect that the Chinese efforts to divert the waters of the Brahmaputra will accelerate as a result.

https://thediplomat.com/2022/02/the-chinese-threat-to-lower-brahmaputra-riparians-india-and-bangladesh/

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  J T

thanks JT
Wow, the sheer size of the project.

Maybe the US should also have thought ahead of moving water to the West and south west.

Climate change is already baked in.
Even if emissions are cut to zero tomorrow it will not change what is going to happen in the next couple of decades.
So it is all about climate change mitigation i.e. planning for the consequences of climate change, eg
a)breakwaters and sea walls for sea level rise,
b)water diversion to predicted more arid regions
c) Storm run off and drainage systems to handle deluge like rain.

Much of what we are seeing was predicted 20 years ago by climate models.
a) large increases in rainfall for Sri Lanka (we have floods all the time now)
b) Drought conditions in West and South west US
c) Moderate rainfall in East US. Cant recall what if Gulf Stream shuts off. Probably drought in East US

So kudos to China for getting prepared for climate change impacts

thewarlock
thewarlock
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

E India will be in trouble with redirection of Brahmaputra. It may lead to Indian state fucking with Indus origin. It will just get ugly in general. Bangladesh is also fucked. Cheap desalination tech is def a big priority

I know you, as Sri Lankan nationalist, dislike the Indian state. But Indian state capacity is literally incapable of the hegemonic style aggression that China is about to unleash. The US is no angel either and has done more historical damage to places. But looking how China is dealing with Uighurs, their model seems to be even more aggressive going forward.

CCP and radical islam, outside of climate change, are the greatest threats to peace and stability in our time.

Gajamardanam
Gajamardanam
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

“As such, the percentage of glacier melt in river flow is approximately 12%. A report by the IWMI puts these estimates at an even more conservative – 2% glacier runoff contribution and 2% seasonal snowmelt contribution to the Mean Annual Flow (MAF)”

https://www.preventionweb.net/news/choking-brahmaputras-flow-much-ado-about-nothing

I think the Brahmaputra threat is much too hyped up. Up to 90% of its water is due to rains in Arunachal and Assam. So, unless rains stop here, there is little China can actually do.

J T
J T
1 year ago
Reply to  Gajamardanam

I agree that the glacier runoff for the Brahmaputra originating on the Chinese side of the border is relatively small. But this is where Arunachal Pradesh comes in. India is going to have to get its act together if China were to launch a serious thrust in Arunachal Pradesh and/or at “Chickens Neck”.

Agreed that Indian state capacity has been historically low grade. Perhaps the advent of Modi and the BJP changes that.

The bigger challenge for India is receding glaciers that feed the Indus and Ganges ecosystems. Climate models are full of dire predictions for South Asia.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

I know you, as Sri Lankan nationalist, dislike the Indian state.
But Indian state capacity is literally incapable of the hegemonic style aggression that China is about to unleash

warlock, no question I am a Sri Lankan nationalist. i dislike the Indian state for its hegemonic interventions in Sri Lanka.
You live in US (citizen maybe) and non citizen Indian Nationalist of sorts. Nationalism is world of difference when one is a citizen of that country, only.

So keep in mind, China/CCP has never interfered in SL’s internal affairs, supporting terrorists like India. In fact China has helped with weapons and money to fight the LTTE terrorist. So call me justifiably biased for China and against India.

China is definitely aggressive, but in business sense. China wants to be the #1 producer of needs and wants, but without military aggression. The place that US and Europe were for over half a century, while using military force to extract resources and enforce unequal trade pacts.

E India will be in trouble with redirection of Brahmaputra.
Two Philosophical/political question.
a) Does the river water originating in country A also belong to countries B and C. In SL, even when the terrorist LTTE controlled the Wanni, the irrigation systems diverting central highlands* water to the Wanni was never reduced or stopped. To the contrary it was the LTTE that destroyed the reservoirs and irrigation channels as they retreated, depriving their own Tamil people of water for personal and agricultural use. Immediately after the war was over, civilian and army personnel were sent to rebuild the destroyed water systems (eg see Iranamadu Reservoir and Kantalai Reservoir). Even now there is a mega project to take central highland water to Jaffna, via Kanagarayan Kulam->Iranamadu Reservoir->Jaffna.
*All rivers in SL originate from the Central Highlands.

b) Does a port belong to a country or are there constraints. Apparently the hegemonic US and India think they can dictate and control how a port is used.

The US is no angel either and has done more historical damage to places. But looking how China is dealing with Uighurs
warlock, you are buying into US propaganda.
I would suggest you have a look at how African American are treated. Despite reams of law and legislation, the reality of discrimination and police brutality has not changed much over three centuries.
The US has 698 prisoners per 100,000 of which close to 50% are black AfricanAmericans. There are more black men in the U.S. prisons than the total prison population in India, Argentina, Canada, Lebanon, Japan, Germany, Finland, Israel and England combined.

Now to IDPs (Internal Displaced Persons) due to US wars in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya. There is a total 5,281,872 IDP’s in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, respectively 4,000,000, 847,872 and 434,000. The total population in 3 countries is 70,886,000. So about 7% of the populations have been displaced because of US hegemonic wars, and still ongoing.
eg Somalia was bombed for the third time this year (Aug 14) and has been so for 15 years.

CCP and radical islam, outside of climate change, are the greatest threats to peace and stability in our time.
I suggest you take a hard look at the data, i.e.# wars, deaths and IDP and it will be quite evident which country is causing instability and outright wars.
Note, China says it is Uighur Islamic extremists that are in prisons.

Regards , Islamic Extremism we can thank the US for that fostering too.
eg1 Carter in 1979 arming the mujaheddin which meta morphed to Taliban/Al Qaeda
eg2; Supporting Saudi Arabia, with petrodollar and military hardware. SA is the biggest propagator of Islamic extremism via funding of madrassas, extremist Wahabi preachers.
eg 3 In Somalia, Al-Shabab (an al-Qaida offshoot) was created when the United States helped to overthrow the Islamic Courts Union after 9/11,

So, I think its the US and its support Islamic Extremism are the greatest threats to peace and stability in our time. Plenty of data to support my view.

Siddharth
Siddharth
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

“China is definitely aggressive, but in business sense. China wants to be the #1 producer of needs and wants, but without military aggression”

Lol, that’s a laugh and a half.

Off the top of my head I can think of at least half a dozen instances of Chinese military aggression – the brutal invasion of Tibet and the destruction of ancient Buddhist monasteries and murdering of monks, invasion of India in the 60s, invasion of Vietnam in the 70s, the creation of artificial military Islands in the SC sea and naval bullying of Vietnam, Philippines, Indonesia, etc. and finally the military aggression in Ladakh in 2020.

The list is probably longer, but don’t let me stop you from enjoying that sweet Chinese kool-aid.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Siddarth

Off the top of my head I can think of at least half a dozen instances of Chinese military aggression
I gave hard numbers of people killed/IDP by the US recent wars of aggression in the mid east.

So why dont you make a list of the wars by China, real wars and those dead and IDP’s

creation of artificial military Islands in the SC sea and naval bullying of Vietnam, Philippines, Indonesia
Nobody dead or displaced. Compare to the displaced of Diego Garcia and Bikini/Bimini. The UN has asked the UK/US to vacate Diego Garcia, not happening.

invasion of India in the 60s, invasion of Vietnam in the 70s,
First it was a border war, unlike US invasion of Vietnam half the globe away. Worse the US was there to help the French colonizers hang on to their colony.
Vietnam’s estimate of deaths from China war 65,000.
The US Vietnam war of aggression, Vietnamese civilian dead: 405,000–2,000,00.
Siddarth you really have problem in comparing numbers.

military aggression in Ladakh in 2020.
Clutching at straws Invasion by 200 Chinese troops. Really.
Heck, India sent in 100,000 Indian People Killing Force (IPKF) in the Sri Lanka invasion.
Extracts from Wiki.
The IPKF perpetrated a number of human rights violations, including rapes and massacres of civilians. Almost all against Tamils.
Indian forces indulged in a number of civilian massacres, involuntary disappearances and rapes during their time in the Northeastern province of Sri Lanka.[31][5] These include complicity in the incidents such as Valvettithurai massacre in which on 2, 3, and 4 August 1989 over 50 Tamils were massacred by the Indian Peace Keeping Force in Valvettithurai, Jaffna. In addition to the killings over 100 homes, shops and other property were also burnt and destroyed.[32]

Another notable incident was the Jaffna teaching hospital massacre on 22 October 1987. Following a confrontation with Tamil militants near the hospital, IPKF forces quickly entered the hospital premises and massacred over 70 civilians. These civilians included patients, two doctors, three nurses and a paediatric consultant who were all in uniform. The hospital never completely recovered after this massacre.

Sino-Indian War between China and India occurred in October–November 1962
Again a minor border war. Indian estimated 1,383 killed Indian Army dead. Really Siddarth, scraping the bottom of the barrel, noh.

the brutal invasion of Tibet and the destruction of ancient Buddhist monasteries and murdering of monks,
To quote: Tibet came under the rule of the Qing dynasty of China in 1720 after the Qing expelled the forces of the Dzungar Khanate. It remained under Qing rule until 1912.
After the Xinhai Revolution in 1911, most of the area comprising the present-day Tibet Autonomous Region (TAR) became a de facto independent polity, independent from the rest of the Republic of China.
I am not really interested in debating China’s claims on Tibet. More the hard numbers.
Apparently 5,700 dead and 3,000 surrendered.

So not a “brutal invasion” along the lines of US?UK invasions of the middle east.

The list is probably longer, but don’t let me stop you from enjoying that sweet Chinese kool-aid.
I would contend that you Siddharth are the one who has drunk the US/UK kool aid. I have given hard numbers.

.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Lol, that’s a laugh and a half.
Off the top of my head I can think of at least half a dozen instances of Chinese military aggression

I would contend that the Indias
a) funding and training of LTTE terrorist
b) IPKF massacres of Tamil Civilians an rape of Tamil women

is much much worse than the so called Chinese aggression.
So, Siddharth do you want to debate the numbers.

Siddharth
Siddharth
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

I wasn’t them comparing to the Western colonialists (in which list I’d include the US), the Euros were obviously orders of magnitude worse. Just disproving your statement that the Chinese don’t do military aggression.

And are you really comparing the actions of the IPKF to the Chinese in Tibet? Hahahaha

Siddharth
Siddharth
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

I’m never a fan of comparing numbers of dead, massacres, etc. as that’s in poor taste but since you actually think the IPKF were comparable to the what the Chinese did (and are still doing in Tibet), here are some numbers from a very cursory look on the internet –

“Although the Cultural Revolution in China was unleashed by Mao to eliminate his enemies and reshape relations within the party,[8] in Tibet, the Cultural Revolution was aimed to destroy Tibet’s religion, culture and identity. When it ended with Mao’s death in September 1976, more than 6,000 monasteries and religious institutions in Tibet laid in ruins. Millions of ancient and priceless manuscripts were burnt. Statues made of gold, silver, or bronze were removed from the temples and shipped to China.[9] The physical torture and psychological traumas endured by Tibetans during public “struggle sessions” and imprisonment were beyond human comprehension. At least 92,000 Tibetans who were subjected to “struggle sessions” died or committed suicide[10] and around 173,000 Tibetans died in prison, or in “Reform Through Labor Camps”

https://tibet.net/revisiting-the-cultural-revolution-in-tibet/

For someone who’s a proud Sinhala Buddhist, you seem quite forgiving for the irreversible destruction the Chinese have done to Tibetan Buddhism and culture

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Siddharth
I am a Jaffna Tamil (3/4th) and a 800 year documented direct male descendant of the CinkaiAryan (in Sinhala AryaSinghe) family of Jaffna.

Regards Tibet.net thats like one of the Khalistani rags that talk of Sikh genocide.
I sure I can find better links
India fought tooth and nail to forestall the intended referendum. It sent a dossier to the British government blaming Pakistan and Paramjit Singh Pamma, “an ordinary criminal”, for sponsoring the event. The UK rejected the request.
The riots resulted in genocide of thousands of Sikhs. Not only the Congress Party leaders like Sajan Kumar and Jagadish Tytler but also police colluded with the killers. India’s then foreign minister
Also see box on left side, HR Violations in IIOJK
https://www.kmsnews.org/kms/2021/11/01/the-khalistan-nightmare.html
And are you really comparing the actions of the IPKF to tibet
I was comparing IPKF invasion of Sri Lanka to your claims of Chinese invasion of India in the 60s and military aggression in Ladakh in 2020.

Hoju
Hoju
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

“b) IPKF massacres of Tamil Civilians an rape of Tamil women”

So massacres of Tamil civilians and the rape of Tamil women is only bad when the IPKF does it? When the Sinhala supremacist state does it at a much grander scale and over a longer time period, it’s all good?

“For someone who’s a proud Sinhala Buddhist, you seem quite forgiving for the irreversible destruction the Chinese have done to Tibetan Buddhism and culture”

The Sinhala learned a lot from China on how to commit crimes against humanity against its minorities. The Sinhala supremacist state is colonizing the predominantly Tamil Hindu northeast, destroying Hindu temples, erecting Buddhist sites, and engineering demographic swamping.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Siddharth

since you actually think the IPKF were comparable to the what the Chinese did
I was comparing Indian IPKF invasion to what you consider major Chinese aggression against India, the Sino-Indian War in 1962 and Ladakh in 2020..

In Ladakh it was a “major” aggression by 200 Chinese troops. Really.
1962 Sino-Indian War 1,383 Indian Army dead. No civilian deaths.

Of course Indians dont think the Indian IPKF was an invasion into SL.
i) India sent in 100,000 Indian People Killing Force (IPKF) to SL
ii)IPKF did number of civilian massacres, disappearances and rapes
iii)Over 100 homes, shops and other property were also burnt and destroyed by the IPKF
iv) The Jaffna teaching hospital massacre by IPKF. Massacred over 70 civilians. These civilians included patients, two doctors, three nurses and a pediatric consultant who were all in uniform.

Tibet.net is no different than khalistani mouth piece. Hardly neutral or unbiased and prone to exaggeration.
The Lamas were no real Buddhists by any stretch, despotic medieval feudal landlords, much like Indian society in the past. Siddharth, you really should read up how the Lamas treated the peasants Absolutely no concepts of equality or egalitarianism and absolute exploitation of the peasants who were all worse than serfs or slaves.

Regards Tibet, China claims it was part of China in past and even in the 19th century. Anyway, I consider Tibet to be a Chinese internal matter. I dont there will be ever a R2P type action.

I’m never a fan of comparing numbers of dead, massacres, etc. as that’s in poor taste
Poor taste or not the numbers of death and destruction give a idea as to which cultures and nations are a threat to peace and stability.
Just keep in mind Vietnamese civilian dead of 405,000–2,000,00 by the US is a million times more than all the so called Chinese aggression.

sbarrkum
1 year ago
Reply to  sbarrkum

Siddharth
For someone who’s a proud Sinhala Buddhist, you seem quite forgiving for the irreversible destruction
First I am a proper Sri Lankan, i.e. a mutt with 3/4th Jaffna Tamil ancestry, Sinhalese and Irish ancestry divide equally.

Also a atheist since about the age of 13, and Buddhist philosophy (not Religion) is closest what I think. That difference in concept well acknowledged by the Sinhalese. Buddhist Philosophy= Buddha Dharma and Buddhist religion= Buddha Aagama.

My paternal jaffna tamil family have a documented 800 year history in Sri Lanka. The family name was CinkaiAryan (AryaSinghe). Web search of CinkaiAryan will give you plenty of hits.

The first documented ancestor, Magha of Kalinga completely destroyed the ancient Sinhalese Rajarata around the 12th century. That said they claimed direct descent from the mythical Sinhabahu of Kalinga who is supposed to have lived around 500 BC. The Sinhalese claim descent thru Vijaya, Sinhabahus son who was banished from Kalinga.
Even genetically the Sinhalese and Jaffna Tamil are closer to each other than they are to Indian Tamil. Also closer to Bengalis compared to Indian Tamils.

If you are really interested in the Jaffna Tamil history read “Yalpana Vaipava Malai”. The English translation is available at ‘noolaham.net/project/47/4684/4684.pdf”

fragment_and_activities
fragment_and_activities
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

Reading this guy, I no longer feel bad for what is happening in Sri Lanka. These guys think that it was some India+US scheming that brought down Rajapaksas.

People deserve their rulers. Yatha praja tatha raja.

Saurav
Saurav
1 year ago
Reply to  thewarlock

LOL

All desi ethnicities want to appear both as ‘martial’ as well ”non collaborators’ , but its a fine line to walk.

Brown Pundits