Massive floods have hit Pakistan’s Punjab province after record-breaking monsoon rains and the overflow of major rivers. Officials report nearly 300,000 people displaced from the province alone and more than a million affected as the Ravi, Sutlej, and Chenab overflowed their banks. Over 1,400 villages are underwater, and there are growing fears of disease outbreaks and food shortages.
👉 ‘The water left nothing’: Pakistan’s Punjab province reels from deadly floods (The Guardian)
This thread is for everyone to share thoughts, updates, and questions about what’s happening.
Jump in and share your perspective.
the entire indo gangetic plain is a flood plain and this will be common in future considering the climate change effect. how is sindh coping up? afterall, eventually the water has to drain south.
The flooding has not reached Sindh yet. But Chief Minister Murad says the government has been told to prepare for ‘super floods’
https://www.dawn.com/live/pakistan-floods-2025
I’m surprised how villages are underwater – colonies made on riverbed is understandable.
The rule of thumb is that when you are populating a village in flood plains, you put them on a little high ground so that the villages are safe from flood waters – which are supposed to come every years, irrigate your fields, refresh the soil, charge the groundwater and take away the salts.
Climate change knows no borders. It would be nice if (despite all the unresolved issues) India and Pakistan could work together on such issues that are meaningful to the majority of our populations.
“Punjab Floods: Rivers Overflow, 3 Lakh Acres of Crops Affected” by Kusum Arora
https://thewire.in/environment/punjab-floods-rivers-overflow-3-lakh-hectares-of-crops-affected
For XTM,
When Sri Lankans dont groom or dress in Western clothes we look like the Veddas. A mix of Aus Aborigines and other Indians.
A good example of this look is Lasith Malinga, the bowler.
This a clip from a Devol festival in the Deep South (this is Unawatuna, Welle Devale)
From Wiki
Devol (also spelled as Dewol) is a deity subjected to worship and belief in Sri Lanka. He is one of the twelve deities worshiped in Sri Lanka as “Dolos Deviyo” (twelve gods), who are believed to be intervening in the affairs of the worldlings The practice of the worship of Devol deviyo or the cult of Devol is widespread among the Sinhalese, specially in the Galle District, South western lowlands and coastal areas of the country.
Look up Sri Lankan Devil (Devol) Dancing clips on You Tube.
Cultural continuity of the First Peoples of of Africa
https://web.facebook.com/reel/1413781563039095
https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/climate-energy/pakistan-says-floods-made-worse-by-indian-action-2025-08-29/
https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/land-use-biodiversity/pakistan-exceptionally-high-flooding-alert-says-india-released-water-dam-2025-08-26/
Reuters really pushing this narrative. I suppose this must be the messaging on the Pakistani side.
Meanwhile the Indians are showing clips of Khawaja Asif saying that the water should be viewed as a blessing and people should store it in their tubs and baltis.
Forget sympathy/empathy or shared misery, politics rules all in kali yuga.
Obviously, the major cause is climate change but India releasing water from their dams certainly didn’t help. Under the IWT, India is supposed to give Pakistan detailed data about the water levels in the rivers etc. Instead, we get vaguely worded “alerts” from the Indian High Commission and this too is framed as a “humanitarian gesture”.
As far as Pakistan is concerned IWT is not in abeyance and it cannot unilaterally be declared in abeyance. The whole point of the treaty is to avert situations like this
.
It is debatable as to whether that’s really of any material use.
Do people really not question why the Field Marshal, PM and Deputy PM are keeping their feet dry in Tianjin while the Defence minister is going around on TV asking people to eat cake?
Anyway, I suppose even if you have any reservations about it you would feel uncomfortable expressing them here.
Flood forecasting would only be improved if India gave the lower riparian country granular information as it is obliged to do under the IWT.
The PM etc are in China because the SCO is a major diplomatic event. It is not the job of the PM of Pakistan to personally handle flood response. We have a National Disaster Management Authority. The Pakistan Army is also helping to rescue people.
I very much doubt Khawaja Asif actually said the water is a blessing. That is a very tone deaf statement and would earn him a lot of criticism while people are being evacuated from their homes.
https://www.thefridaytimes.com/30-Aug-2025/pakistan-s-floods-expose-decades-of-mismanagement
I can understand if uneducated rural bumpkins fall prey to political propaganda about blaming India, but when self-proclaimed educated elite “liberals” engage in rampant Indiaphobia and not-so-subtle Hinduphobia, its just pathetic.
Cynically weaponizing an ongoing human tragedy impacting millions, especially the poor, for personal bigoted agendas, is beyond the pale.
Of course there is mismanagement. But it’s also true that the upper riparian country has not provided accurate data which is needed for flood forecasting.
There is nothing “Indophobic” and certainly not “Hinduphobic” about this.
Every comment you write here exposes a certain level of hatred against Pakistan. To coin a phrase you have “Pakistan Derangement Syndrome”.
Well, happily it is on tape.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Cp08aENhiQ
4:35 mark
Your top 3 leaders are being wined and dined for a military parade right now, the SCO is over.
Nero(Munir) playing the fiddle and Antoinette(Khwaja) eating cake.
For this to be poetic we need another analogy in there, maybe we can fit the vile Indians in somehow.
Well, if Khawja Asif said that, it was very tone deaf of him. He represents Sialkot which is underwater (incidentally it’s where my mother grew up)
Once again, the PM and the Army Chief are not personally involved in flood response nor do they need to be.
Maryam Nawaz is CM Punjab and she’s very much in Lahore leading from the front. Pakistan Army is assisting her.
Failed Marshal’s predecessors have Dubai flats and Amreeki Dominos franchises. Nobody questions any of it. Far easier to blame India, and evil baraahmans.
tis an old playbook. If blame India chooran doesn’t sell well, there’s always the corrupt politicians to fingerpoint at. Anybody but the parasitic PakMil that continues to savage the enslaved Pakistani citizenry.
I was a child when General Musharraf removed Nawaz Sharif. I remember seeing the New York Times that day on the dining table of our house in Washington. It’s one of my first political memories about Pakistan.
I have been solidly team Nawaz Sharif ever since that day. So I am not someone who can be accused of “fingerpointing” at “corrupt politicians”.
a lot is made out of the SCO meeting. some anti trump voices from u s a have said that trump spoiled a strategic relation with india. did they expect that india will fight u s a’s war with china?
as the good general of ‘gunner’s shot’ says, u s a is not india’s enemy and china is not india’s friend!!!.
I wish both sides would stop politicizing the floods.
Here’s an article from DAWN acknowledging the damages in Indian Punjab:
“Villagers marooned after deadly floods in Indian Punjab”
Again “sem2sem”
Considering the raging insurgencies in Balochistan and KPK where the Pakistan army gets screwed regularly (very different from beating up unarmed protestors) and the recurring floods every year, Pakistan’s future looks bleak.
They will remain an economic basketcase and watch other countries peel away – including India whom they seceded from and Bangladesh who seceded from them.
For the last time, India was created on August 15th 1947 exactly when Pakistan was created.
Pakistan was part of BRITISH India which was a colony. Secession is not the correct term to use. One “secedes” from a nation-state NOT a colony.
This is an extremely stupid and ahistorical argument.
Using that logic, Pakistan was created on 16th December 1971.
Pakistan was created on August 15 1947. United Pakistan was not a colony but a nation-state.
This is not a subjective opinion but an objective fact. BRITISH India does not equal the Republic of India.
Kabir you know that ROI is considered to be the successor state of British India; that is a legal opinion.
Bangladesh came into being 1971 not 1947.
Why do you insist on tit for tat
One recognized by UN, IOC, FIH, ICC etc.
Unlike Russia, Serbia etc didn’t even need to change names.
Oh is Serbia the successor state to Yugoslavia
A colony is not a nation state. Pakistan did not SECEDE from India. You cannot secede from a colony. You can only secede from a nation-state.
I know Indians like believing that their country has always existed and Pakistan is artificial. The historical fact is that both nation-states were created at the exact same time.
Yes but you are belabouring the point; legally ROI is the successor of British India.. that is in international law
That doesn’t at all take away from my point that India and Pakistan were both created at the exact same time. They are equally valid as nation-states.
A colony is not a nation-state. That’s simply historical fact.
Another historical fact is also that India is the successor state to British India thus inheriting everything.
Both the Russian Federation and Ukraine got “created” at the same time. Who got the UNSC permanent seat?
Both the French Fifth Republic and the Republic of Algeria got “created” at the same time. Who got the UNSC permanent seat?
You can keep arguing all you like. It doesn’t change the simple fact that my nation state is equally valid as your nation state.
This conversation is becoming increasingly inane so I’m not going to be responding further.
What is an objective fact is that the Republic of India is the SUCCESSOR STATE of British India. They got the capital, the parliament, the UN membership, the cricket/hockey teams, the Olympic records etc all of which predate 1947 and the creation of Pakistan.
Pakistan started from scratch.
Similar to how Russia is the successor state of the USSR not Ukraine, Belarus etc and they retained the capital, the nukes, the UNSC permanent membership etc.
You say all this to justify your existence knowing fully well that Pakistan is just an INDIAN rump state whose name didn’t exist before the 20th century.
INDIA on the other hand is a many millenia old civilization and the ROI is just its current incarnation.
This is similar to the Russian Federation, the People’s Republic of China, the French 5th Republic, the Federal Republic of Germany etc – all civilizational powers.
Pakistan is akin to something like Taiwan or Bangladesh, a completely new entity. Nothing wrong with that. Portugal seceded from Spain and built up a decent legacy.
lol Portugal precedes Spain!!!
The Kingdom of Portugal seceded from the kingdom of Leon. One went on to become Portugal, the other part of Spain.
Portugal is older than Spain
I am talking about nation-states. I’m not interested in talking about colonies or empires.
Pakistan doesn’t need to justify its existence. We are a nuclear armed nation state of 250 million people. We are not going anywhere.
Calm
That doesn’t change the objective fact that Republic of India is the successor state to British India not Pakistan.
Pakistan lost more than half it’s population in 1971 so a part of it definitely did go somewhere.
Considering the Balochistan insurgency and TTP/Afghanistan’s belligerence, Pakistan might soon become a “nuclear armed nation state of 160 million people”.
Pakistan was not a nuclear power in 1971. We are now. We are not going to lose a single inch of territory ever again.
Even nuclear powers have broken down (see USSR).
What is Pakistan going to do – nuke its own territory?
Balochistan and KPK are not calming down anytime soon.
Secession is a red line. The Pakistan Army will never allow any part of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan to secede.
My relatives live in Peshawar. Most people in KPK have no desire to secede from Pakistan.
Balochistan is not capable of secession. Just as Kashmir is not capable of secession.
Territorial integrity is a red line. You can dream of Pakistan’s territorial integrity breaking down all you like but this is a delusion not a realistic possibility.
It has already happened once. Who is to say it won’t happen again?
And the KPK issue is not in Peshawar but in the tribal areas.
And like I said – what is Pakistan going to do? Nuke its own territory?
You can dream all you like. The borders will not change. The Pakistan Army will absolutely never let that happen.
Unlike Occupied Kashmir which is a DISPUTED TERRITORY and subject to UN resolutions, Balochistan is unequivocally a province of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Secession is an absolute nonstarter.
I removed the histrionic bits
Bombay-Badshah seems to be one of the those Indians who is gleefully waiting for Pakistan to fall apart. This is extremely toxic behavior.
The reality is that Pakistan cannot militarily free Occupied Kashmir. India cannot take Balochistan from Pakistan. Secession in both cases is an absolute non-starter.
There will be a nuclear war if Pakistan’s territorial integrity is threatened. This is not “histrionic” but our officially stated nuclear doctrine. We will never lose an inch of our territory again.
Kabir calm – I don’t agree with what he says but why feed it? Let it be ..
I don’t want to keep belaboring this point either.
But I do think that attacking a country’s territorial integrity–whether it is India or Pakistan– needs to be a redline on this blog.
Nuclear war with whom?
Own Pakistani citizens?
India has no intention of taking Balochistan.
It is the brave Baloch people fighting for their freedom from the tyrannical Pakistani state.
Pakistan Army is perfectly capable of dealing with secessionists.
Well, considering what has been happening in Balochistan and KPK, seems unlikely.
2025 already has more fatalities than last year and 4 more months are left.
Soon the good old days of the early 2010s will be back.
Here’s a substack I liked:
” To Be Seen Whole: Blackness, Muslimness, and the Politics of Art”
https://topibechwa.substack.com/p/to-be-seen-whole?
They brought back abayas and long beards, Azaan clocks and stricter gender codes. “Khuda Hafiz” became “Allah Hafiz.” Sufi shrines were increasingly dismissed as heretical. Qawwali gave way to monotone recitations. Inch by inch, the textures of Indian Islam—the poetry, the music, the local dialects of faith—were replaced by something colder, more distant, more rule-bound. What was once a rich, syncretic, emotionally expansive faith shaped by regional culture, language, and folklore was slowly flattened into uniformity.- quoted from cited subtrack.
i) the indian muslims do not have universal textural references to their practices, while the wahabbis always show the book and the are right.
ii) the english educated muslim middle class has moved away from ‘ syncretic’ islam, and now the pasmandas are caught in between.
iii) muslims were a ruling class in india. to club them with dalits ( former untouchables) is just an academic excercise and not in reality. dalits will never be muslim’s equals and hence this does not stick. at the end of the day a dalit is a hindu kafir for a muslim.
iv) most muslim localities share their borders with dalit areas and there is hardly any intermixing.
The author of this substack is an Indian Muslim. He also clearly states that he is from a “pasmanda” background.