Please keep the other posts on topic. Use this for talking about whatever you want to talk about.
00votes
Article Rating
13 Comments
Oldest
NewestMost Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Milan Todorovic
5 years ago
There was an interesting discussion on BP last week on the margin of one topic. It was about (non)memories on migrations of particular nations. Razib stated that, for. e.g. Hungarians and Turks remember while Greeks and English do not remember their migrations to today’s territories.
There is one characteristic which is common for all these migrations. All previous mentioned migrated to the land occupied by Serbs.
Hungarians have very developed memories in their traditional folklore to the migration conducted in 896 AC during four years. They came to Europe in place where Serbs lived and coexisted for centuries. In the 17th c. Serbs were still majority in today’s Hungary. Subsequent genocides and aggressive assimilation reduced their numbers today to few thousands.
Turks came to Asia Minor where Serbs lived for centuries and where later came Greeks and Jews. Accepting Jews who returned from Mesopotamia to overpopulated Palestine was praised recently by Netanyahu. There were Serbian kingdoms Phrygia, Lycia, Lydia and there are still about 9 millions of people in Turkey who remember their Serbian origins.
Greeks came after their expulsion from Egypt initially to Med islands where Serbs lived including Crete known by previous Mino civilization. For long time Greeks lived only on few islands, only couple places on mainland and one place in Asia Minor. Whole mainland including Mt Olympus was populated by Serbs. Later, they used historical moments to push native population and assimilate many of them, in same time taking over and replicating their mythology (also tried to make that Alexander the Great, i.e. Lesander Karanovic, was a Greek).
English came to British Isles where Celts lived. Celts were a Serbian rank originated in Vinca civilization with a mission to go, find new land and settle there. First settlements they made in Spain and Portugal (its first name was Serbia). Edward Longshanks (known from Braveheart) at the end of 13th c. conducted ethnic cleansing of Irish and statutory prohibited their names, languages and sports. Their names were identical with other Serbian tribes, for e.g. Robert de Bruce who won the war for Scottish independence (1314) had such name which survived until today (also Damian, Tara, etc). EL also tried to convert Jews and expelled them from England. It was mentioned an example that Wiltshire got its name from the Serbian tribe Wiltsa and its main town Salisbury was previously Serbarium.
Serbian history is the biggest tragedy ever. Once Kosovo was Serbian, Bosnia was Serbian, Eyjafjallajökull was Serbian, Antarctica was Serbian, Uranus was Serbian; now all they have is one modestly-sized country next to Croatia.
Plus the way Serbs are demonized as bad people, Nazis, racists, Islamaphobes all over the world, especially among post modernists (which is rich considering that socialists and communists use to back Nazis) and Islamists. Only Israelis and Jews are demonized worse.
Serbia is one of Israel’s closest and most loyal allies.
Serbia suffered greatly at the hands of Islamists. Much of the population was killed, converted into slaves, forcibly converted to Islam (Bosnia and I suspect ethnic Albanians and Kosovans). Islamists tried to destroy Serbian culture, historical records, civilization, educational institutions, spiritual institutions.
But Serbs are not allowed to mention any of this. If they do they are called Islamaphobes and genocidal psychopaths.
Thanks Anan. This is not a lonely case of irrational haterage against Serbs. We could see this before and during the bombing by Nato with 1000 their planes and uranium bombs. That guy could not say anything, could not find a single mistake and maybe because is so frustrated. There is another one or two guys like him (including the guy who did not know the name of his own country and who regularly gives his heart to similar comments). Last time the above tried to ridicule my assertion that Alexander Karanovic was a Serb and when I asked him to present his knowledge/opinion he disappeared and did not comment for months. It is nothing special with my original comment. Serbs were indigenous European people and, similar to US/Canada, all others (Hungarians, Greek, Turks and other) came to territory where they lived. They also moved to various directions (north Africa, British Isles, Egypt, Mesopotamia, China, etc). They also, as Aryans, came to SA, established settlements, lived there for thousands of years, some returned back to old homeland, many got assimilated and, as we could see from neighboring thread, about 16% of Indians have Serbian genes.
Re: Serbs, Jews and Arabs. Serbs had traditional good relations with ordinary people but had a strong enemy in US deep state (they actually ordered bombing) and Jewish media in US which conducted this media demonization. The most of leading politicians were Jews (Albright, Cohen, Zimmerman, Holbrooke, etc) who were hawkish anti-Serb. On the other side, Serbs had very good relationships with Arab and Islam countries and leaders (Iraq, Egypt, Iran, Algeria, Libya, Tunis, Senegal, Palestine, Indonesia, Turkey, Sudan, Morocco, Nigeria, etc). Qaddafi adored Serbs and the whole his environment until his killing were Serbs (cooks, security, technical staff, etc.). Islamic leaders slowly are realizing that the Christian Orthodoxy is the closest to Islam without any animosities and hypocrisy as Catholics and protestants have. Because of that many Islamic states did not recognize occupied Kosovo (Egypt, Indonesia, Libya and others) as did Islamic leaders who are puppets of US deep state (e.g. S.Arabia).
In the early 1990s, the US thought it could do anything with impunity and bombed Belgrade and sided with Kosovars uncritically. I am sure 30 years after that has taught the US few things and would not do such a thing now. While Trump’s isolationism looks purely personal choice of Trump’s idiosyncrasies , it has some historical force behind it. Unlike early 1990s, Russia and China are not isolationists now.
A new kind of pottery Ochre Coloured Pottery (OCP) is now being linked to the Mahabharata post the Sinauli chariot findings.
The circa 2000 BCE date of the Mahabharata mesh well with Tilak and Jacobi dating of the Rig Veda around 4500 BCE calculated when the AIT was a fully accepted theory. Oak’s date 5561 bce is too early, imho.
Very interesting Mayuresh Madhav Kelkar. Can you suggest any of these history scholars that can be interviewed for Brown Cast?
I love Oak but agree that his data for the Mahabharata is difficult to justify with the evidence now available.
Do you think that the Kurukshetra war happened circa 2000 BC? Can you share some more information supporting this hypothesis? [It would take several long form essays to elaborate on why I feel this way . . . but I suspect but don’t know that the Mahabharata text might have been edited over several thousand years. But the Mahabharata text is different from the actual historical events that the Mahabharata alludes through, albeit with exaggeration, interpolation, storytelling license and fantasy mixed in.]
I partly disagree with Tilak and Jacobi but would like to elaborate more in long form essays. It appears to me that the Vedas might have been compiled over many thousands of years. So some Samhitas of the Vedas might be a lot older then 4500 BC. Maybe even pre global flood/ice age (pre 9700 BC), although I have no evidence to prove this. But the close off date for the Vedas I think was around 3 thousand BC. After which the Vedas were locked so to speak. This accounts for odd things like why the battle of the ten kings (which is semi recent) is discussed in the Samhitas.
Note that by the time Krishna was born the Vedas were locked. Which is why none of Krishna’s sayings (even the Gita) were added to the Upanishads. Despite this, several passages about Krishna in the 18 Mahapuranas and Mahabharata and Hari Vamsha and other related texts are deeply respected. Just regarded as far more recent in composition.
The above is merely a running hypothesis that might change with incoming data.
Mayuresh, when do you think horses were first domesticated in SAARC, Turan, Iran, Xinjiang, Tibet and South East Asia?
19.1.1990 Day of genocide of Kashmiri Hindus when they were driven out of their homes by Jihadis sent by Pakistan. 29 years too long for reversion and still no end in sight.
One of the towering figures in the Indian subcontinent Khan Abdul Gaffar Khan aka Bacha Khan , a worthy leader of Pashtuns and Indian freedom movement . It is 31 years since he died. I hope Afghanistan and Pakistan bring back his legacy. Bacha Khan’s legacy is the only practical way out of the violence in which Af-Pak finds itself today
There was an interesting discussion on BP last week on the margin of one topic. It was about (non)memories on migrations of particular nations. Razib stated that, for. e.g. Hungarians and Turks remember while Greeks and English do not remember their migrations to today’s territories.
There is one characteristic which is common for all these migrations. All previous mentioned migrated to the land occupied by Serbs.
Hungarians have very developed memories in their traditional folklore to the migration conducted in 896 AC during four years. They came to Europe in place where Serbs lived and coexisted for centuries. In the 17th c. Serbs were still majority in today’s Hungary. Subsequent genocides and aggressive assimilation reduced their numbers today to few thousands.
Turks came to Asia Minor where Serbs lived for centuries and where later came Greeks and Jews. Accepting Jews who returned from Mesopotamia to overpopulated Palestine was praised recently by Netanyahu. There were Serbian kingdoms Phrygia, Lycia, Lydia and there are still about 9 millions of people in Turkey who remember their Serbian origins.
Greeks came after their expulsion from Egypt initially to Med islands where Serbs lived including Crete known by previous Mino civilization. For long time Greeks lived only on few islands, only couple places on mainland and one place in Asia Minor. Whole mainland including Mt Olympus was populated by Serbs. Later, they used historical moments to push native population and assimilate many of them, in same time taking over and replicating their mythology (also tried to make that Alexander the Great, i.e. Lesander Karanovic, was a Greek).
English came to British Isles where Celts lived. Celts were a Serbian rank originated in Vinca civilization with a mission to go, find new land and settle there. First settlements they made in Spain and Portugal (its first name was Serbia). Edward Longshanks (known from Braveheart) at the end of 13th c. conducted ethnic cleansing of Irish and statutory prohibited their names, languages and sports. Their names were identical with other Serbian tribes, for e.g. Robert de Bruce who won the war for Scottish independence (1314) had such name which survived until today (also Damian, Tara, etc). EL also tried to convert Jews and expelled them from England. It was mentioned an example that Wiltshire got its name from the Serbian tribe Wiltsa and its main town Salisbury was previously Serbarium.
Serbian history is the biggest tragedy ever. Once Kosovo was Serbian, Bosnia was Serbian, Eyjafjallajökull was Serbian, Antarctica was Serbian, Uranus was Serbian; now all they have is one modestly-sized country next to Croatia.
Plus the way Serbs are demonized as bad people, Nazis, racists, Islamaphobes all over the world, especially among post modernists (which is rich considering that socialists and communists use to back Nazis) and Islamists. Only Israelis and Jews are demonized worse.
Serbia is one of Israel’s closest and most loyal allies.
Serbia suffered greatly at the hands of Islamists. Much of the population was killed, converted into slaves, forcibly converted to Islam (Bosnia and I suspect ethnic Albanians and Kosovans). Islamists tried to destroy Serbian culture, historical records, civilization, educational institutions, spiritual institutions.
But Serbs are not allowed to mention any of this. If they do they are called Islamaphobes and genocidal psychopaths.
Thanks Anan. This is not a lonely case of irrational haterage against Serbs. We could see this before and during the bombing by Nato with 1000 their planes and uranium bombs. That guy could not say anything, could not find a single mistake and maybe because is so frustrated. There is another one or two guys like him (including the guy who did not know the name of his own country and who regularly gives his heart to similar comments). Last time the above tried to ridicule my assertion that Alexander Karanovic was a Serb and when I asked him to present his knowledge/opinion he disappeared and did not comment for months. It is nothing special with my original comment. Serbs were indigenous European people and, similar to US/Canada, all others (Hungarians, Greek, Turks and other) came to territory where they lived. They also moved to various directions (north Africa, British Isles, Egypt, Mesopotamia, China, etc). They also, as Aryans, came to SA, established settlements, lived there for thousands of years, some returned back to old homeland, many got assimilated and, as we could see from neighboring thread, about 16% of Indians have Serbian genes.
Re: Serbs, Jews and Arabs. Serbs had traditional good relations with ordinary people but had a strong enemy in US deep state (they actually ordered bombing) and Jewish media in US which conducted this media demonization. The most of leading politicians were Jews (Albright, Cohen, Zimmerman, Holbrooke, etc) who were hawkish anti-Serb. On the other side, Serbs had very good relationships with Arab and Islam countries and leaders (Iraq, Egypt, Iran, Algeria, Libya, Tunis, Senegal, Palestine, Indonesia, Turkey, Sudan, Morocco, Nigeria, etc). Qaddafi adored Serbs and the whole his environment until his killing were Serbs (cooks, security, technical staff, etc.). Islamic leaders slowly are realizing that the Christian Orthodoxy is the closest to Islam without any animosities and hypocrisy as Catholics and protestants have. Because of that many Islamic states did not recognize occupied Kosovo (Egypt, Indonesia, Libya and others) as did Islamic leaders who are puppets of US deep state (e.g. S.Arabia).
In the early 1990s, the US thought it could do anything with impunity and bombed Belgrade and sided with Kosovars uncritically. I am sure 30 years after that has taught the US few things and would not do such a thing now. While Trump’s isolationism looks purely personal choice of Trump’s idiosyncrasies , it has some historical force behind it. Unlike early 1990s, Russia and China are not isolationists now.
https://twitter.com/getfiscal/status/1085363641166295040
Where did this meme originate from?
Has it become a meme or is it just one guy saying stuff?
New article by Giacomo Benedetti of New Indology blog
http://new-indology.blogspot.com/2019/01/mahabharata-and-archaeology-chariot-of.html#comment-form
A new kind of pottery Ochre Coloured Pottery (OCP) is now being linked to the Mahabharata post the Sinauli chariot findings.
The circa 2000 BCE date of the Mahabharata mesh well with Tilak and Jacobi dating of the Rig Veda around 4500 BCE calculated when the AIT was a fully accepted theory. Oak’s date 5561 bce is too early, imho.
Very interesting Mayuresh Madhav Kelkar. Can you suggest any of these history scholars that can be interviewed for Brown Cast?
I love Oak but agree that his data for the Mahabharata is difficult to justify with the evidence now available.
Do you think that the Kurukshetra war happened circa 2000 BC? Can you share some more information supporting this hypothesis? [It would take several long form essays to elaborate on why I feel this way . . . but I suspect but don’t know that the Mahabharata text might have been edited over several thousand years. But the Mahabharata text is different from the actual historical events that the Mahabharata alludes through, albeit with exaggeration, interpolation, storytelling license and fantasy mixed in.]
I partly disagree with Tilak and Jacobi but would like to elaborate more in long form essays. It appears to me that the Vedas might have been compiled over many thousands of years. So some Samhitas of the Vedas might be a lot older then 4500 BC. Maybe even pre global flood/ice age (pre 9700 BC), although I have no evidence to prove this. But the close off date for the Vedas I think was around 3 thousand BC. After which the Vedas were locked so to speak. This accounts for odd things like why the battle of the ten kings (which is semi recent) is discussed in the Samhitas.
Note that by the time Krishna was born the Vedas were locked. Which is why none of Krishna’s sayings (even the Gita) were added to the Upanishads. Despite this, several passages about Krishna in the 18 Mahapuranas and Mahabharata and Hari Vamsha and other related texts are deeply respected. Just regarded as far more recent in composition.
The above is merely a running hypothesis that might change with incoming data.
Mayuresh, when do you think horses were first domesticated in SAARC, Turan, Iran, Xinjiang, Tibet and South East Asia?
Again thanks for sharing Mayuresh.
Nilesh is the Raj (king)!
There’s a new Grandmaster in India, out of Chennai (to no one’s surprise).
https://en.chessbase.com/post/gukesh-becomes-second-youngest-gm-in-history
What is it with the South (Tamil Nadu especially) and chess? Why is the cow belt so incapable of things like this?
19.1.1990 Day of genocide of Kashmiri Hindus when they were driven out of their homes by Jihadis sent by Pakistan. 29 years too long for reversion and still no end in sight.
Bacha Khan Week
https://twitter.com/hashtag/BachaKhanWeek2019?src=hash
One of the towering figures in the Indian subcontinent Khan Abdul Gaffar Khan aka Bacha Khan , a worthy leader of Pashtuns and Indian freedom movement . It is 31 years since he died. I hope Afghanistan and Pakistan bring back his legacy. Bacha Khan’s legacy is the only practical way out of the violence in which Af-Pak finds itself today