This article might seem provincial and mostly irrelevant to non Americans and maybe it is. But for Asian Americans and Latino Americans this is an increasingly important subject.
Indians and Indian Americans love the Clintons . . . including conservative Indians, and Republican Indians; but a line from Hillary Clinton’s speech in Mumbai has an eerie uncanny feel to it:
It is no secret that Asian Americans massively outperform caucasion Americans based on every available socio-economic statistic; including divorce rate, out of wedlock births, academic performance, mean and median income, mean and median wealth, rate of committing criminal offenses, incarceration rates, unemployment rates during recessions (unemployment rates during economic booms are similar), entrepreneurship.
These well known facts represents the greatest fear Asian Americans have. How to prevent a major anti Asian American xenophobic racist jealous backlash similar to what Jews are currently experiencing?
Has the time come for Asian Americans, Arab Americans, Muslim Americans and Latino Americans to ask to be considered “white” for all legal, affirmative action, business and secular purposes? Of course all academic, US census, DOJ tabulation of granular statistics for legitimate purposes should continue as is; and every American has the right to practice any global culture and faith they choose.
Many “darkies” and “minorities” are too afraid of the wrath of the post modernists to bring this up, and maybe they are right to be.
Of course massive racism, oppression, exploitation, bigotry, sectarianism, violence against a community often aids said community economically. For example if not for massive racism, oppression, exploitation, bigotry, sectarianism against Chinese Indonesians (3%) over many generations; would Chinese Indonesians still own 70% of Indonesia’s wealth? The same might be true of ethnic Chinese minorities in Vietnam, Thailand, Laos, Philippines, Malaysia, India, Europe, North America, Latin America, Africa. The same might also be true of Jewish people around the world. Or of Indian ancestry communities all over the world, or of Marwari Indians, or of Lebanese ancestry communities all over the world.
But this economic achievement is not necessarily for the right reasons. Sometimes people are so afraid of a future holocaust against their community that they become successful no matter the cost, including quality of life. Not that this massive socio-economic success helped German Jews in the 1930s. This searing example is the greatest nightmare of “darkies” and “minorities” all over the world.
“The evil eye” or jealousy is one of the deadliest sins in almost every if not every religion in the world; but also one of the subtlest and toughest to address. In the long run is there anything that can be done to avoid widespread global use of the phrases “Asian privilege” and “Asian supremacy”?
What are everyone’s thoughts?
1) half of latinos check white for their race on the census (different from hispanic/latino)
2) those latinos who are “white-presenting” code-switch all the time to take advantage of their whiteness. though they sometimes adhere to “person of color” when advantageous. i find it pretty annoying as a lejit brown person.
Does anyone think Rick Mehta is being persecuted (professor at Acadia University) because he is Asian Canadian or because he makes a case for why English colonization of India had positive characteristics (specifically that the English helped prevent sectarian tension and violence in the British Raj)?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbQlapzOirY
Strangely his views wouldn’t be unusual in South Asia. Some articles about which are below:
http://www.brownpundits.com/2018/03/06/how-the-english-should-provide-soft-power-reparations-to-india/
http://www.brownpundits.com/2018/02/25/nuanced-understanding-of-british-colonialism/
There must be over a hundred articles at Brown Pundits on this topic.
This is deeply disturbing. Universities displaying polit buro level diabolical strategies was never something I thought would happen. But I guess enough money and lack of accountability can produce such outcomes.
Conservative pundits and regular right leaning folks have been pointing out the economic achievements of Asian Americans for decades as proof that progressive arguments concerning white privilege and economic disparity based on skin color are ridiculous. Another great example, seldom mentioned these days, are the boat people. Refugees from South Vietnamese arrived in this country with nothing yet had worked their way into the middle class (and beyond) in one generation and did so in the face of real racial hostility from the lower classes of all colors. Yet another example is the economic and academic accomplishments of Africans who immigrate to America which are light years ahead of American born blacks.
Indian and Chinese American males are already considered white dudes by elite universities as well as giant tech companies like Google, Apple and Facebook. When you look at the electoral map and note how much of it is red you should understand that in the vast majority of America there should be no fear of racism, bigotry or jealousy of Asians; the right is not the source of racial quotas, identity politics, bean counting or overt racism. These will only be problematic if the country turns into a one party system run by democrats. And that is inevitable if we allow open borders and chain migration to continue because Hispanic migrants vote overwhelmingly for democrats and believe (at around 80%) in big government. They also use social welfare programs at significantly higher rates than native born Americans.
I live in South Texas where whites are a distinct minority, in my county we comprise between 3 to 5% of the population depending on the month (Winter Texans are generally retired blue collar whites who migrate to numerous trailer parks in the area during the winter months). In South Texas a significant number of high status Latino’s marry whites (this applies to both genders) and the distinction between Anglo and Hispanic is rarely noted – it’s no longer an issue.
It is my belief that Asian’s who come to this country and excel in the hard disciplines of STEM, high tech and medicine have nothing to fear from the native born population unless the radicalized democratic party, with its race based hysteria, identity politics and divide and conquer racial tribalism gains national prominence. I don’t think it will happen but if it does we will be in for a rough ride.
Yes I think there is such extensive intermarriage between Asians & white people that American is “devolving” back into two ethnicities, White & Wakandan.
I think that’s what has hurt Wrinkle in Time. Rather than make a poignant film, Ava DuVernay (love the surname) went out of her way to make a statement ..
Of course I’m seeing the US from the trans-Atlantic prism..
How about we just loose the hyphenated BS and be Americans?
The divide and rule concept of the DNC is so obsolete – it illustrates how out of touch the old farts of the Democratic wing [home of the KKK and the Confederacy] of the Democratic-Republican Party is…
Requoting Teddy Roosevelet:
“There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism. When I refer to hyphenated Americans, I do not refer to naturalized Americans. Some of the very best Americans I have ever known were naturalized Americans, Americans born abroad. But a hyphenated American is not an American at all … The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin, of preventing all possibility of its continuing to be a nation at all, would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities, an intricate knot of German-Americans, Irish-Americans, English-Americans, French-Americans, Scandinavian-Americans or Italian-Americans, each preserving its separate nationality, each at heart feeling more sympathy with Europeans of that nationality, than with the other citizens of the American Republic … There is no such thing as a hyphenated American who is a good American. The only man who is a good American is the man who is an American and nothing else. I do believe that the racial rhetoric coming out of the States is getting a bit heated.”
I do think the age of the Nation-State is coming to an end; I see the right-wing populism as sort of a last gasp by a dwindling majority but what do I know?
I think a lot of Arabs already think of themselves as “white” and that is what they check on the census. I don’t know that the majority population would think of them as white though.
The average South Asian (Indian, Pakistani or Bangladeshi) cannot pass for white. Persians probably could.
Regarding “hyphenated Americans”, I am Pakistani-American (born in Pakistan but lived most of my life in the US). I am loath to have to give up either aspect of my identity.
I think the ‘South Asian’ activist and academic community in the US is not a very admirable one. What is most terrible is the way they piggyback on the genuine problems of Black Americans due to centuries of institutionalized discrimination to push forward their own ethnocentric programs. The idea here is to deploy Black Americans as a bulwark, this despite the reality that far more White Americans (even proportionally) marry, work with and live together with Black Americans, than these South Asian descendants of erstwhile landlords and British Raj bureaucrats.
I think the underlying reason is the desire of overcoming the sheer instrumentality of their parents immigration to the developed world. This is expressed as an impatient desire to somehow rewrite American history to claim their place in American history, instead of letting such a place develop naturally over generations.
Vikram, many Indians play large roles in business, technology, medical, law, lobbying, wall street organizations. I most definitely agree that their role is less than fully positive . . . which can be elaborated a different time.
Please share your thoughts on ” the ‘South Asian’ activist and academic community in the US.” Not completely sure what you mean.
I notice that few South Asian Americans talk much about African American issues and that Asians in general are deeply uncomfortable with the phrase “people of color”. Ali Risby for example.
I meant Ali Rizvi, a Pakistani American.
Vikram, what has the South Asian American community suffered since the 1921 and 1924 Immigration Acts? Seriously? When Indians came to America they were told by caucasion Americans that they were the good immigrants, the good minority. Plus the same race family, Aryans; and nothing like African Americans. South Asian Americans were also told that they weren’t Jews (in the 1940s, 1950s, 1960s America was a far more openly anti Jewish country). Asian Americans have been treated better than Jews in America. These are anecdotes that I have heard from long time Deshi immigrants. I don’t think there is any comparison between what African Americans went through and what Asian Americans went through. Any attempt to draw such comparisons are insulting to African Americans.
Vikram, you are right that South Asian Americans haven’t treated Black Americans any better than caucasion Americans (maybe even worse); and should acknowledge as much.
I have a comment regarding the 1921-1924 immigration acts. The authors wanted to ban “Jews” but couldn’t legally do it. So they tried the next best thing and ban almost all Asians and people from other parts of the world. They reduced Italian immigration by over 98% for example. I know that many South Asian Americans now loudly condemn this. Here is the thing, countries all over the world regularly ban or heavily restrict immigration from large parts of the world. Do they equally condemn these countries (I would)? If not, they should be quiet.
In other words anyone who attacks America for the 1921 and 1924 immigration act should also equally condemn Pakistan and Bangladesh for not accepting immigrants from India, and condemn India for not accepting immigrants from many countries, and China/Japan/Russia for not accepting material numbers of immigrants from many countries.
Any South Asian heavy organization that isn’t heavily focused on reducing jealousy directed towards South Asian Americans is unhelpful in my book.
South Asian Americans are very racist (sorry to say). The worst nightmare of many Pakistani immigrants is that their child marry a black person. Marrying a white is still ok (though most in the community would prefer their child marry a Muslim).
Why should Pakistan accept immigrants from India? India also only wants non-Muslim immigrants. Pakistani Hindus are seen by Modi as “our own people” but Pakistani Muslims, not so much. Similarly, Pakistan had a policy whereby people came over freely until sometime in the 1950s and became Pakistanis. After that, I think some treaty was signed with India and some nationality law was passed. Now, I think almost the only way to become Pakistani is to marry a Pakistani. These are the consequences of religiously defined states, but that’s a topic for another day.
“South Asian Americans are very racist (sorry to say). The worst nightmare of many Pakistani immigrants is that their child marry a black person. Marrying a white is still ok (though most in the community would prefer their child marry a Muslim).” Zero disagreement. Not as courageous as you are though. I am afraid of being politically incorrect.
I think India should encourage and accept large number of immigrants from many countries. India would benefit enormously from this; much the way North America and Chile have benefited enormously from immigration. Specifically India should accept any Pakistani minority who wishes to move to India provided get through strict vetting–including Sufis, twelvers, sixers, Ahmedis, Hindus, Buddhists, Sikhs, Christians, Sindhis, Balochis, Pashtuns, Kashmiris, liberal Sunnis, atheists.
Pakistan would also benefit from accepting immigrants, I believe.
Unless someone believes that Pakistan should accept immigrants from most of the world now; they should not criticize the US 1921 and 1924 immigration acts. I have seen some South Asian Americans complain about the 1921 and 1924 immigration acts as “racist”; which is what prompts this comment.
“Why should we not have a place in American history?” You should and you do. I think that Vikram and I were referring to South Asian Americans who try to free ride on African American freedom struggle as if they are fellow “victims” (something that South Asian Americans and South Asians from South Asia did almost nothing to help.)
Pakistan was founded as a homeland for the Muslims of British India, not for all the world’s Muslims. It is not Israel, to which all the world’s Jews can make “aliyah”. I think Pakistani immigration policy reflects this. From 1947 until some time in the ’50s, lots of “Muhajirs” came from India and settled in Karachi. I don’t think they had too much trouble becoming Pakistanis. Pakistan and India made some treaty regarding population exchange and naturalization (I’m not an expert on these details).
As Slapstik jee said on another thread, Pakistan needs to let go of “musalmanoon ki chuhdrahat”. I quite agree with this. We have 200 million of our own citizens (muslim and non-muslim) to worry about. The fate of the rest of the world’s muslims should not be our primary concern.
As for the US, I am a fan of legal immigration. My parents stood in line, followed the rules and then became Americans. I am not a fan of illegal immigrants (whom we are now supposed to call “undocumented”) except for those who were brought as children. They didn’t make the decision to cross illegally and the US is the only home they have ever known. This is an interesting debate happening within the US now.
Why should we not have a place in American history? I moved to the US when I was 5 years old. It’s basically my home. It’s probably different for those who come for higher education. For example, my parents spent their entire lives in Pakistan and only went to the US for graduate school. They identify strongly as Pakistanis or “desis”. For me, however being American is at least 50% of my identity.
Zachary Latif, read:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2018/03/14/how-white-nationalists-are-trying-to-co-opt-black-panther/?utm_term=.78108d5548cf&wpisrc=nl_az_most&wpmk=1
What does Wakanda mean?
“White nationalists have embraced “Black Panther,” Marvel Comics’ blockbuster, to push their argument online that nation-states should be organized by ethnic groups, according to new research published Wednesday, an unlikely convolution of the ground-breaking African superhero movie.
One popular image circulating on far-right corners of the Internet shows the title character — the superhero king of the fictional, secluded and wealthy African nation of Wakanda — wearing a red “Make Wakanda Great Again” hat. This is an explicit homage to President Trump’s “Make America Great Again” campaign gear.
The image, first posted online in June, months before the Disney/Marvel film’s February release, carried a headline of “BLACK PANTHER IS ALT-RIGHT,” referring to the movement that espouses racist, anti-Semitic and sexist views and seeks a whites-only state. It claimed the superhero opposed immigration, diversity and democracy while favoring “ethno-nationalism” — a profound mischaracterization of the movie’s main themes, according to researchers at Data & Society, a New York-based think tank that studied far-right online conversation about the film. They said the film uses science fiction and “Afro-futurism,” a thematic exploration of African and African American history, to explore real-life questions of culture, race and politics.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1100&v=1bs_BbIBCoY
Notice how the current global zeitgeist is focusing more and more on Asians and Asian ancestry expat communities around the world. Global wealth, income, knowledge, intelligence, power and influence is increasingly concentrated among people of Asian ancestry. And slowly the focus of global academia is turning against Asians–who are increasingly seen as leading the “globalists”.
Asians are playing a large role in the creation of advanced artificial life, brain therapy, bio-engineered body parts, gene therapy, and incorporating AI directly into the human brain and nervous system. Which puts Asians in the bulls eye of global conspiracy believers.
Note the way the cutting edge of academy is turning on modernists (marxists), structuralists, post modernists, subaltern studies, “deep thought”. Academics of Asian descent have been fighting this fight for some time–but are now starting to write and speak publicly. Darrell Hamamoto openly calls these old school academics stupid idiots. Including the academics at his own department in the University of California. He says that the Asian American department might ask him to leave.
Darrell Hamamoto speaks about the large role of Asians in organized crime and in globalist domination. And strongly decries the ethno-nationalist cards.
I think it is worth listening to this interview. It might take a few months to process what he says. I don’t fully understand what he is saying yet.
Does anyone want to destroy this article by Alvin Chang? He wants Asian Americans to celebrate and cheer massive discrimination against Asian Americans through affirmative action. Is anyone dumb enough to fall for it? Is any Asian American against affirmative action a tool for the alt right, racism, bigotry, white supremacy? How dumb does Alvin Chang take us to be?
https://www.vox.com/2018/3/28/17031460/affirmative-action-asian-discrimination-admissions
[…] don’t know the answer, but the attack is coming. Already a plurality of the world’s billionaires are Asian. And soon a majority will be […]